lilgeneser

SigmundTheSeaMonster

jarque

That's not very high, eh?

petersterncan

And as far as commercial use is concerned, I am sure corporate america can figure out how to minimize the number of miles its products are shipped by road... That means more gas for everybody, less money for the terrorists, more investments in America, good guys win, bad guys lose, etc.

You live in the country and need a big truck? Your choice, you pay... Maybe you could give a Subaru Forester a try?

DuraAce

FЯeeMan

I guess not nearly enough people on here are aware of the boats these things are often bought to tow, which measure in GALLONS PER MILE.

This truck is nothing to powerboat owners with $25K props. Hell, they'll spend an avg persons salary on a paint job for this truck to match the boat.

rlj676

ChaoticLimbs

-Xenophobic comment courtesy of myself, Matt Stone & Trey Parker

LandofMinos and the Adventures of Governor Frontbottom

discontinuuity

sos10

franzouse

Stuntdriver

NovaloadMissesPolar

The thing that really confuses me about all of these hate-laced comments towards these vehicles (F650) is the general impracticality of some of the solutions. Is a handful (relatively) of these trucks really going to make that much of a difference in the grand scheme of things? It makes about as much sense as C.A.F.E. requirements. It does nothing to address the automotive body as a whole. Most cars on the road aren't properly maintained, and I know I've seen more than a few cars that are spewing so much smoke they've probably got 1/4" between their pistons and cylinders they're so worn out. Those bad boys are doing a lot more damage than a big truck driving beside it. But the large truck is low-hanging fruit, so why not?

Now, I'll admit I'm one of the more practical commentors on here. If you don't need a truck, don't drive one. Simple as that. But fact is, in Texas, quite a few people need one. We've got a lot of space, and lots of people that live in a truly rural environment (I know, that's a tough concept for some of you) have a genuine need for a large, gas-mongering war machine.

So what I guess I'm trying to say is, leave well enough alone. Just because you don't have a need for something doesn't mean no one else does. And for the people that really don't need one? You're wasting more energy getting all wound up about it than that single truck is.

Unevolved 8.04

Did you ever know that you're my hero,
and everything I would like to be?
I can fly higher than an AMC Eagle,
'cause you are the wind beneath my coil springs.

I hope after writing that you did your own
personal pose-down in the closest mirror!
Well said!

POLAЯ is taking his work underground. He can't let it fall into the wrong hands again!

Personally I have a 13 year old 4WD S-10 as it's all I require. And I only drive it when I need a truck or 4WD. Most of the time I drive a 4 cylinder car or a motorcycle.

Unfortunately it's kind of an illusion because my friends' 4WD Suburban gets better gas mileage generally (than the S-10 that is).

mytdawg

Yes, we individually put this thread together via silent conspiracy of emails just to piss you off. But only after we lured you in with a lengthy and very time consuming pretense of loving cars.

Please, by all means, let it be the last post for you. (This is the first flounce I've seen on Jalopnik.)

It's not worth taking your sloppy reasoning apart, but here are a few lowlights.

There is no "one" reason for anything as complex as tax codes.

How do you save money by not recycling? It's free in most places.

I missed the posts wanting to "destroy and waste everything that exists on this planet." God help you if you read into everything the way you read into this thread.

If you read Jalop, you'd know that a lot of us drive cheap beaters with little engines, some ride bikes, and some have no cars and use public transit!

"Imagine everyone else in the world" is a logical fallacy--it's hypothetical plus it's based on a slippery slope structure, which is also a fallacy.

"Infantile cock replacements" is a very troubling phrase.

Good luck with that anger issue, bud.

NovaloadMissesPolar

We do not have to live like this. There is no need for all of this waste, and the earth cannot possibly sustain this kind of lifestyle much longer. I see commenter after commenter whining about the risk of losing their god-given right to destroy and waste everything that exists on this planet and I feel nothing but disgust. I love Jalopnik because I enjoyed the illusion that there were car-fanatics who were also well-spoken and aware of things beyond the limited horizon of strictly automotive matters, but clearly I have been deluded.

Just keep imagining that every other person in the world makes decisions in a similar fashion (viz, China + India - Nanos wont suffice for much longer) and take a minute to visualize the results in another twenty years.

And I assure all of you that 1000 ccs in a sufficiently light body provides more than enough thrills. The FSO 125 Pickup with a mildly breathed on twink which I used to hoon in Greece was assuredly much more fun than any of these infantile cock-replacements.

/end-rant, mayhaps last post

mr.chophoppers

OK, I forgot to add in the last several countries that joined in the last 3 or 4 yrs.

My point was Europe is far more densely populated & far more developed. People from urban areas are terrified to even be where we live & not just from U.S. urban areas, ANY urban areas.

Where we are gets as cold or colder than Minneapolis/St Paul due to the altitude, 7200' (2200m).

Its not somewhere most people care to or want to live, but it suites us.

CyberRanger

@Eric Merrill: It's not just the gas and maintenance. He'd have to register, inspect, and make sure his insurance extends to that other car as well. Once that's factored in, the savings dwindle - though from 10 to 25-30 MPG, there might still be some benefit.

FuzzyPlushroom

Eric Merrill

Somehow though we've also evolved into sucking at doing just that, in so many ways.

Eric Merrill

- There are rich people in the world, lots of them. They buy things like this, your favorite NFL team has people who own them. They are filthy, stinking rich...

- These trucks are recession proof. Marketing timing doesn't come into play for trucks like these because people who buy them are...see above point.

- The same for the mileage they get, the person owning this also has a boat that gets 1-4MPG on the open sea. If you shame people who get poor gas mileage, just fixate on the boat they also likely have until your head explodes.

When someone reaches double digit millionaire status, it's no longer about the bank account. It's about status and this is one of the things people buy to get it. It's not practical, it makes Mother Nature take one for the team, but they buy them anyway.

Hello_Newman

RobertRyan1

I concur that these trucks are ill-suited to most people. Most of the ones that I have ever seen were either sitting on sales lots for extended periods of time, or were being used by companies for jobs too heavy for a 1-ton pickup and too light to justify purchasing a heavy truck. I actually have a client who uses one for his three businesses: transporting cars to and from auctions for used car lots, renting large dump trailers and cargo containers to construction sites, and moving home furnishings for people with too much for a U-Haul and too little to ship with a more mainstream shipper. He's spun that TopKick and a small fleet of trailers into a million-dollar, fairly diversified enterprise. Since he works six days a week, he doesn't bother with owning another vehicle and just drives the big truck all the time. I've heard people in town make negative comments when they see that truck at the golf course, in the grocery store parking lot, or even at church, but in his rare case, it makes the most sense.

BigJames80

eeh.. not that it that important... but the rocky mountain states cover 856,078 square miles of land, while the EU covers 1,707,642 square miles, more than double.

Population of the RM states is just above 18 million, while the UE almost 500 million so, around 28x more habitants.

True though that the wide open spaces are nowhere to be found in Europe. Extreme winters as in the north of US are also rather rare in Europe.

sos10

@chrystlubitshi: My mother's got a New Beetle (1.8T, manual) and she's quite pleased with its capabilities... never really gotten stuck. It's not as low as it looks, and with a good set of Continental all-seasons, it's got damn good traction.

FuzzyPlushroom

NovaloadMissesPolar

chrystlubitshi

chrystlubitshi

markov - type gna(R)

And I am not a fan of government bureaucracy, but a tax in this "pay to play" sense does not tell people what they can and cannot do, it just makes them pay the full cost of their driving a Commercial vehicle for non-commercial use (and an F-150 is not commercial), which, in my mind, is protecting my freedom to not pay for the damage they do just driving to the damn store. The government would not tell anyone what to do or force anyone to do anything.

And to CYBERranger, I am not saying there should be more taxes on actual commercial drivers, that would be criminal.

markov - type gna(R)

BigJames80

RobertRyan1

RobertRyan1

I love people who say these are wasteful but just love sports cars that are useless for business, get 10mpg when driven the way most are, and go through tires in 5k miles.

IronEagle

(I'm 15 minutes from the border, and it seems like every day a new house goes up, and some Mass. ex-pats move in...)

And we gotta pay for things somehow, without an income tax. Tollbooths may not be an ideal solution, but they do work.

FuzzyPlushroom

Then again, I've known a few suburban kids who've gotten Z-71s (a popular 16th B-day gift round here) stuck axle-deep in drainage ditches in their front yard.

I can't claim that I need a truck really. I live near downtown Houston and work in the legal field. But I've always appreciated the versatility and reliability of Chevy 1500s. I'm willing to sacrifice some $ for a V8 and rear/four wheel drive. It may be a lifestyle thing for me; I don't think that makes my choice much different from many Jalops. You sacrifice utility and MPGs for a fast, tight-handling car. I like the utility, reliability and comfort of a full-size pickup.

TX Law

If you're talking about the 80C I'm thinking of, we're on the other side of the highway & closer to the border. We can look down into Cherokee Park from our livingroom windows.

CyberRanger

Funny you should mention that. Before we lived out here we lived in a city of about 110,000. We didn't like it much either. We knew only about 3 or 4 of our neighbors on the block of about 20--although not due to our lack of trying. They simply didn't want to know us.

Now we have roughly 13 neighbors within 3 miles of us. We're all on 35 acres (14 ha) each. We know all of them & several have become very good friends.

Isolated? Hardly. We were more isolated living in the city than we are now.

We very much value the quiet, the clean air, virtually no crime (what there is is petty), the friendly neighbors & our relaxed lifestyle.

CyberRanger

1) The F-650 and F-750; Produced at the Blue Diamond Plant (along with Internationals) at their plant in Escobedo, Mexico.

2) The Dodge 4500 and 5500, along with the badge engineered Sterling Bullett is manufactured at the Saltillo, Mexico facility, along with Most Dodge 2500, 3500, and Megacab Diesel Dodge Ram Trucks.

3) The Chevrolet Large Pickups and SUVs are produced in Janesville, Wisconsin; However their most profitable versions (the Hybrids, and the Cadillac Versions) are built in Silao, Mexico. The soon to be sold off Topkick, and Kodiac (4500, 5500, 6500, and up) are built in Flint, soon to be transferred to, yes, Mexico.

Now for some surprises:

4) Hino Trucks (a division of Toyota) produces their trucks in Williamstown, WV, and currently also produces them in Ontario, CA. Hino produces class 4 - 7 Trucks like these:

5) Most North American Trucks Manufacturers are now Foreign Owned:
Freightliner - Owned by Mercedes Benz
Sterling - Again Mercedes
Western Star - Think again; Mercedes
Mack Truck - Owned by Volvo AB
International - Yes this is american owned; However it has been de-listed off the NYSE for failing to provide accurate financial statements for the past 5 years.
Peterbilt - Along with Kenworth, this is the PACCAR group, and yes, primarily US owned.
Volvo - No, this is not owned by Ford, since it was Volvo that sold the then money losing car line Ford, and nothing else. The other Volvo AB bid=sinesses are all humming along quite profitably (Trucks, Construction Equipment, Aeronautics, Information Systems)

The point to all this rant? Well, my point is this: Capitalism is great, but uncontrolled capitalism can become harmful. Case in point. GM Makes clear profit from building Trucks and SUV's in Wisconsin, and Flint, Michigan. However, they wanted a BIGGER profit margin, so they built them in Mexico, actually undermining the american workforce. GM and Ford also blundered when their Big Truck Operations when they felt that there wasn't enough profit being generated by these divisions, so they sold them off to Foreign interests. GM Class 8 Trucks were sold off to Volvo, Fords were sold off to Mercedes (and re-badged Sterling), and now you are looking at the number 1 and number 2 Truck Makers in the world.

My point is sometimes you have to reign in excesses, from ridiculous profit levels, to oversize trucks and homes, to outrageous behavior for the good of everybody concerned.

UDMan

I lived for 5 1/2 years in Northern Colorado..nothing but fond memories of getting in the woods of 80C

(sigh)

LT1

NovaloadMissesPolar

NovaloadMissesPolar

There is no urban sprawl. There is no urban at all. Its simply empty country that most people find too harsh a place to live. I'm amazed at how many people can't tolerate living more than 5 minutes from a grocery store. We can't even get newspapers delivered out here. Thankfully we have wireless broadband Internet access.

CyberRanger

My wife works for an international company & has coworkers from India, China, Israel, Germany, France, etc. She has hosted company functions on occasion & her guests are simply astonished at the open areas we have in the western U.S. You cannot fathom how wide open it is out here until you come here. I went to school (in Colorado) w/ people from NYC & they couldn't believe it either.

Even in the eastern U.S., towns are rarely more than 10 miles apart, sometime less. Out here it isn't unusual to have towns be 75 miles (120km) apart or even homes be 2 or 3 miles (3-5km) apart. Some of the ranches around us are 12,000, 17,000 or even 24,000 acres in size (4900, 6900 & 9700 ha). 40 years ago one ranch was 250,000 acres (100,000 ha) until the owner lost it thru financial mismanagement & it was divided up to pay his debtors.

The Rocky Mountain states alone are roughly the same size as the EU yet it has 1/50th the population density or less.

I'm just saying its an entirely different place to live, so please don't judge us using your standards.

We had one neighbor move in & she had a Prius. She found it totally useless. She couldn't drive it 6 months of the year due to the weather. Half of the rest of the year it couldn't carry the supplies she needed to bring home w/ her. Its is now up for sale.

CyberRanger

Second: I can't decide if those are sweeping generalisms or awful insults. Not every person who wants cleaner air and advocates an end to unnecessary waste falls under that string of unpleasant words.

Eric Merrill

@Mike the Dog: Not offended at all. I've been called worse.

DannyBN

In some ways it is inferior to our truck, however, our Dodge has its limitations. This F-650 has a towing capacity that far exceeds what we can tow. That is a function of axles, tires, brakes, transmission, etc. I was very pleased to see Dodge finally come out w/ the 4500/5500 series to compete w/ the Fords & GMs.

It is interesting that they chose to use the same series engine as the new Dodge's, albeit w/ seriously upgraded power & torque.

CyberRanger

"I once heard freedom defined as 'the right to be offended'. Can't say I've heard a better definition since."

This was true in the 70s, but the self righteousness, hate mongering, liberal would-be-elitists have the PC police to ensure that only WASPs have that that right anymore.

smokeydog001

cityag

Eric Merrill

Anyway, I drove a '99 2500 for a while, my mom's husband let me borrow it while my car was getting some repairs. He had it ridiculously lifted and such, but it's really, REALLY not the practice in excess this Geiger is. The 2500 is, to me, the largest truck 99.7% of people will really ever need. He's towed boats, jetskis, a borrowed RV, it's all been fine. I do take issue that he used it to tow these things maybe four times a year; it would have been better and cheaper for him to just rent a UHAUL on those days.

Then he went and bought a 3500, put a camper on the back of it, and uses it to drive to work and back as a civilian at the local air force base. I can't wrap my mind around it at all. He hasn't used it once.

Sure, I'm sure somebody in this world has loaded themselves down with so much excess and exclusion that, roughly 10% of the time or a maximum of 5 months out of the year, they could utilize about 40% of this truck's power. In complete honesty, I irrationally discriminate against these people, because like many commenters here and their dislike for 'hippies,' I just don't like them. Let's all face it here, whether we're republicans hating on democrats or democrats hating on republicans, it's our ability- and right- to pick and choose our stances and discriminate our definitions of right and wrong. I may harm some of you by attempting to take more of your paycheck, and you some of you harm me by smogging the crap out of my air and making my dream urban lifestyle unprosperous and difficult (in Phoenix, AZ).

Cyber, I enjoyed your post; and I don't mean any insult towards you. I'm sure you afford your family a beautiful life.

Although I'm certainly not one-sided on this, I think we should all reach a gentleman's pact not to sling words like "liberal," "hippie," "butterflies dying," "yuppie scum (even though this could be used by EITHER side)," "redneck," "hick" etc etc because the second somebody hears an insult that could apply to them, they generally shut down, and neither of the "sides" represented here at Jalopnik get a chance to educate, learn and understand. We can disagree entirely, argue fruitlessly even, but the insults aren't necessary.

Eric Merrill

suttree

sos10

suttree

sos10

cityag

Through ...

warpig

warpig

discontinuuity

Knights of personal responsibility, they are.

thatguy01

We do not have unimpeded freedom. No one of serious import has ever suggested or fought for it.
The government is already telling you what to drive. We have CAFE standards and crash testing, not to mention the financial protection provided to the Big Three, and the auto union, should the economy suffer a hiccup.
The government can tell you that you must bear a disproportionate tax burden should you choose to drive such a vehicle.

And whats more, you understand that. Your first argument was not out of freedom - you realized that's too complex - you argued out of what everyone here agrees with: Necessity. If your life necessitates a vehicle like this (even considering the higher costs, including taxes) by all means you are entitled to ownership, however, I am sure all the comments here are predicated on the fact that 70% of all Chevy Suburbans are sold to parents who work in office buildings and have three kids. That hardly meets the definition of necessity.

wjfreemont

I once heard freedom defined as 'the right to be offended'. Can't say I've heard a better definition since.

kleinlowe

@CyberRanger: It's obvious that you (and many other people) have need of large capable heavy-duty vehicles. I submit, though, that from a practical standpoint in the case you present, this vehicle would be far inferior to the rig that you have already. Which is kind of the point some of our fellow Jalops are trying to make. We are making fun of people who would buy a hugely impractical vehicle and use it as a daily driver in the city for nothing more than a fashion accessory (or manhood supplement, etc.).

@markov: You aren't taking into account the new layers of bureaucracy you would have to institute to administer it and prevent fraudulent exemption claims. Besides, legislating morality doesn't work. Haven't we figured that out yet?

Mike the Dog

At least it's got commercial plates.

And DannyBN - we're gonna keep saying "ayuh" and using our directionals, and there ain't a damn thing you can do. Heh heh!

FuzzyPlushroom

In the U.S., the government doesn't have the right to tell you what to drive. They don't have the ability to tell you that you can't drive a giant truck if you want to. This is called freedom.

CyberRanger

I don't think anyone would have a problem seeing this thing pulling an RV out of a ditch. Big working commercial trucks get my dragon going like nothing else. It's just when you put it in the context of a suburban commuter vehicle that people start to get whiny. It's painful like seeing someone strap a load of plywood to the roof of a 911 or a trailer hitch on a classic 450sl convertible (real examples).

Do we have the right to whine when people produce, market and buy these as status symbols rather than any intent to actually use them? Well, yeah, I think so. Being wasteful makes gas more expensive and parking more difficult for me, dammit. And it's a waste of a good truck, too.

kleinlowe

markov - type gna(R)

Whether something like this would ever fly in America is questionable, and I hope that if it ever does come to pass, the government can see when one of these vehicles is necessary to its owner.

markov - type gna(R)

CyberRanger

oldskoolparts

sos10

Nightwing

oldskoolparts

oldskoolparts

You can't tow anything bigger than an oversized cooler w/ your econoboxes. We need something that'll tow our travel trailer or utility trailer that can get thru more than 8" of snow & gets relatively decent mileage, hence our Cummins powered 2002 Dodge Ram 2500 Quad cab w/ 36" tires & Banks exhaust brake.

It gets 20 mpg on the highway if we don't drive 80 mph, is big enough to seat SIX & 10x safer than a Prius if a 1500 lb cow or 500 lb deer decides to wander out in the highway in front of us or if some sleepy yuppie drifts into our lane of traffic in their Subaru or Honda. Where we live this happens a lot. We routinely pull out neighbors & visitors who think their AWD CR/V or Bimmer can go thru more half a foot of snow.

If y'all don't know why anyone needs anything like this, then you don't know much. Many people in doing their jobs need trailers far too large to tow w/ a weenie 1/2T pickup, but don't need a Class 8 or 9 semi either. Just 'cause its big doesn't mean it gets bad mileage. Bigger oftens means more efficient.

For some folks it is cheaper to retire in their RV than it is to pay property taxes & live at home, especially in places like California. Many of the bigger RVs cannot be towed w/ even the biggest stock 1T pickups. Why not spend your winters in Tucson & summers in Montana or Alaska when you retire? You can sell your house for far more than what an RV tow rig & RV costs & have something you can take anywhere.

Y'all need to stop being so narrow minded. You think that just because YOU don't have a use for something, no one can.

BTW, not all red necks have mullets & not everyone who has a mullet is a redneck & not everyone who drives a big pickup is a redneck. My wife certainly isn't a redneck.

CyberRanger

p3p3

kleinlowe

JayP71

Speaking of which...

Unevolved 8.04

discontinuuity

turbo1168

discontinuuity

no_slushbox

screamingbluemessiah

carguy

p3p3

oldskoolparts

beercheck

DannyBN

beercheck

smokeydog001

Capitalism and personal property rights must have really laid a steamer on you at some point.

beercheck

MattP

v8corvairpickup

oldskoolparts

I beg of thee, as a fellow New Englander, let's direct our disdain at those who truly deserve it: people from New Hampshire.

DannyBN

I don't particurly like them, but I do like the fact that they piss off people who are so deserving!

smokeydog001

oldskoolparts

Mike the Dog

DannyBN

smokeydog001

DannyBN

amblito

macecalrissian

No, I'll take that back. This is for people who grew up wanting to be truck drivers but never made it.

Astos Green lasers rulz

Astos

NovaloadMissesPolar

ifonlyihadthemoney

HoubaHouba!

Maymar - now with 37% less anonymity

From a utilitarian perspective, it's a highway trailer puller. Big trailer. The pickup bed is a gag; a flat hitch platform would be more practical. The owner has an expensive hobby (horses, boat, racing), so his rig would be fun, too. It's just cool to make the truck a cartoony pickup instead of a standard commercial truck, but the tinsel doesn't really reduce its utility compared to a plain commercial truck.

The F650 SUV, OTOH, is much less useful. It can't pull a big gooseneck trailer, like this pickup. The SUV wagon body can't be loaded to a fraction of the truck's mammoth capacity, and it's too physically big to be a practical passenger car or offroader.

thatguy01

whatever dude

Dr.Danger, Shogun of Jalopnik

B

F-650 starter edition (F from fiat and 650 cc) [www.mitchell.derbycounty.co.uk]

BЯдΖǐL-ЯЄРΘЯΤЄЯ Grows trees to get his CO² balance done

Sorry. You want to play, then you gotta pay.

BMRFILE

Rick Astley

skulldriveshaft

jarque

turbo1168

Lorem Ipsum

HDC

tenbeers

jarque

Is this the same 6.7l Cummins as the Ram?

BlackIce_GTS

ALSO: Imagine the huge Truck Nutz you could suspend from this thing! Big enough to make an elephant jealous I'd bet. I mean, if you're into that sort of thing.

jarque

muleshoe

turbo1168

damnElantra

Mike the Dog

SupermotoThud

turbo1168

A friend of mine that builds offshore race boats and I built this one from an ex-Ryder truck. Swapped the 366ci. gas engine for a CAT 3116. Definitely a head turner and got better mileage than his 1 ton 454 Chevy P/U shortbed dually. It averaged 12-13 mpg on the road. A whole lot of fun to drive but limited in it's rearward visibility! A red Miata sideways can get lost behind it (ask me how I know!) [[i82.photobucket.com]]
[[i82.photobucket.com]]

turbo1168

petersterncan

tenbeers

smokeydog001

Froggmann

If we pay $10/gal like many parts of the world, these vehicles would be non-existent.

BMRFILE

It can't be very good off-road. A solid axle Toyota, jacked up Sami or Jeep would be far better.

There's no way it can be a work truck when you'd have to lift things over your head to put them into the bed.

Does it offer any towing advantage? I understand you can get ridiculous amounts of power out of regular full-size diesel pick ups.

What is the point? Are people really just that desperate to have strangers stare at them?

PS we're not staring because we're impressed, confusion is the best response you're gonna get. "What's he compensating for?" is probably the most common reaction.

arowsell

bmoredlj

DucatiChuck

BЯдΖǐL-ЯЄРΘЯΤЄЯ Grows trees to get his CO² balance done

Nothing new here Tropical a Brazilian company did this in 2002 its called the Tropical Ford F-12000 F-Maxx [www.f650himarc.com]

BЯдΖǐL-ЯЄРΘЯΤЄЯ Grows trees to get his CO² balance done