<![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are? - Jalopnik Comments]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are? - Jalopnik Comments]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Detroit...detroit...No, no bad market place. You go home and think about what you did...Uh, you don't have one, Oh. Sorry.

quayzar

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> How about something on track days. Take one of your normal cars (Murilee's Civic or P71, Jonny's WRX would all be good candidates) and walk us through what it takes to get them on a track.

LeMons, you've been talking about fielding a car for a couple of races now. Do it, and document the whole process.

Tokyo Auto Salon / Japanese tuning scene in general. Yeah, the body kits and wings are a bit stupid but the major tuning houses get nutso power out of small displacement turboed engines and still get them to handle. Plus they'll race anything. And you can't deny Kei cars.

something_unique_and_descriptive

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> You folks sound like a bunch of babies! If I had the opportunity to check out the auto shows like you do, I would not be complaining. I can only go to the show like everyone else on the public days. Matter of fact, can I cover Chicago for you since I live in Chicago? The trip out here from Detroit is a pain in the ass!
I had the opportunity to catch the tail end of the media day in Detroit a couple of years ago and let just say I got drunk really quickly!

DetroitWhat

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> I'd love to see a return of "You will know us by the trail of parts". Heck, commentors could even kick in articles for that one.

JayP71

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> I want "Fast as a Shark" back, that was a sweet segment and some damn good writing.

clashtastic

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> I think that covering more enthusiast based car shows and car club gatherings would be awesome, more PCH, more things to discuss, more ways to know the Jalop-team, maybe a feature on our own daily drivers (Autoblog has a feature like this every once in awhile, but, c'mon, we're cooler.), more reports of auto-based legislation state by state.

My my, now I feel greedy.

Benito

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Go back to digging up wannabe El Caminos and Rancheros and more DOTS and PCH. The DOTS and PCH cars have more design, style and look like they weren't all the product of General Foyota Peugbaru Nissenz Chryroën Mitsat Hondwagen Werke's central design studio.

Triborough

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> After looking at the cars of the Detroit show, I think Jalopnik should give awards of some sort to people in the car industry who are aiding the enthusiast cause--people like Bob Lutz, for example, or the guys who dreamed up the ZR1. On the other hand, there should also be a Jalopnik-based militia group that will hunt down the people who are destroying everything cool about the car industry. I bet many members of the BMW Car Club of America would be willing to contribute to a bounty on Chris Bangle, and I'm sure Detroit would be a happier place if Bob Nardelli was tied up in someone's basement listening to horror stories about shopping at Home Depot. We don't have to KILL people... we just have to make them suffer until they mend their ways.

I call dibs on Peter Horbury.

Armand Bengle

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @Al Navarro: Those were mid-engined, weren't they?*

I don't want to say I'm burned out on Detroit, but I miss the giant Hot Wheels, the outlandish cars that'll never make it to production, the stuff that made you excited for the future. Just about everything interesting at Detroit is a few months away from production.

Now, in the spirit of LeMons, what about the BABE (Big Apple to Big Easy) rally? I don't know if it's quite as cool, but it seems similar, coaxing whatever $500 (and some creative accounting) will get you from New York to New Orleans.

*For the record, I have a Serenity poster in my room (the guy who lived in it before me was an even bigger geek than I am). And Jewel Staite is cuter (she's a space mechanic!)

Maymar - now with 37% less anonymity

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> More Mike Watt references

SwapMeat

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> You could come to Ypsilanti this spring and cover the Orphan Car Show. Sunday, June 1 2008. Riverside Park, always many interesting examples (Usually a Tucker or two to be seen...)

Mike the Dog

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> SCCA Rallycross

Dr.Danger is in Denial

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> I would say cover Detwa and NOT NY or LA...then cover a vintage race and show and the international shows.

Can someone go to Essen?

Al Navarro

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @danms6: Wow, that's a great summary!
@POLAR: Everyone would have to fly a flag above the camper with the jalopnik alias on it. Or the editors could have a contest, audience decides which is who. Although I really, really think I could pick you out of a crowd, Polar.

Instead of new car shows, can we have old car shows? Can we have more LeMons? More PCH?


NovaloadMissesPolar

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> I haven't minded Detwa. Gotta cover it, even if most of the concepts aren't my style. It's a nice change from the usual day-to-day stuff, though as far as content goes I usually find car shows (read: crossover concepts) to be the oats of my Oatmeal Raisin Car Blog Cookie of Satisfaction. An important component, to be sure, but I'm really eating that cookie for the DOTS, JFG, Trail of Parts, Classic Ad Watch raisins.

Overwrought metaphors aside, let me second Goodwood. It would be great to have Jalopnik's, um, unique perspective alongside traditional old-fart print media like R&T. Might see some cars that would put the JFG Aston Zagato to shame, too.

ZZMarcus

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @POLAR: You think the Jalopournalists want to be anywhere close to all us weirdos?!

That said, I'd be up for somethings burnt (i.e, rubber, meat, and car weirdos).

@Euromobile: Why not just go local (to some Jalopournalists) and cover the Sno*Drift stage rally in Atlanta, MI (btwn Gaylord and Alpena) 25-26Jan (in two weekends)? [www.sno-drift.org]

SeanKHotay

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @Spence: Fuck Yea!!

Buckster

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @Spence: You sure about that? Seems a bit out of character...

Back to TFQOTD:
More grass-roots stuff. There's racin' within driving range of all of you every weekend. Not to mention swap-meets, club meets, etc.

Hell, just spend the evening at the local drag strip or off-roading location and see what you can see.

Reviews/drive tests. I love Edmunds older long-term testers (84 Ferrari, '02 M3).

Actually...that gives me a crazy idea: Jalopnik Reviews You! I'd gladly submit any of my fleet to be flogged/reviewed by the Jalopnik staff. I'm sure others would as well.

More projects. Ben's Lincoln is awesome. Trail of the Parts was awesome (where'd that go, btw?). Again, I'd submit either of my 2 rides in need of work/modification (Jeep & 67 Ford) as documentable content.

More DOTS-type stuff. Around me (which means around Jonny) there are a ton of specialist shops with lots full of cool cars. I'm sure the owners have some interesting stories to tell about some of the vehicles on their lots.

Meet-ups would be cool, but they need to be in an appropriate location, not just some bar. Auto museums, Junkyards, race-tracks, and abandoned fields (HOTD, anyone?) all qualify.

Mad_Science

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> LET'S DO IT!!!! MY WIFE WILL FLICKING HATE ME!!!! BUT WHO CARES!!!!

POLAЯBEEЯ

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> I would really like to see a Jalopnik BBQ type event at something like the Woodward Dream Cruise. Granted, it's in Detroit as well (well, Royal Oak actually), but it's an event that everyone who loves cars should check out anyways.

You're already gonna be covering the Dream Cruise so this would fit right in.

rlj676

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @Dr.Danger: Still the best summer song out there...

Which reminds me... I wanted to throw out the question:

Your favorite song to drive to?

(You can expand it to favorite song to Hoon balls too if you wish...)

I can't control my need for speed when I hear "Ace of Spades" by Motorhead... this song helps me drive home from work.

Also, I really enjoy the guitar solo in freebird...

Braff S. Preston, Esq.

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Enter one of these and post coverage:

Plymouth-Banjul Challenge: [en.wikipedia.org]

Mongol Rally: [en.wikipedia.org]

Or you could go check these out: [www.burningman.com]

Failing that, I second the auction coverage. Everything from police auctions to snobby high-end stuff; million dollar vintage Ferraris and such.

Euromobile

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @Dr.Danger: I'm not sure who started these bullshit song parodies, but The Fresh Prince borders on lyrical anarchy!

...but summer time is good, especially for da boobies! (o)(o)

POLAЯBEEЯ

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @POLAR:
Here it is the groove slightly transformed
Just a bit of a break from the norm
Just a little somethin to break the monotony
Of all that hardcore dance that has gotten to be
A little bit out of control its cool to dance
But what about the groove that soothes that moves romance
Give me a soft subtle mix
And if aint broke then dont try to fix it
And think of the summers of the past
Adjust the base and let the alpine blast
Pop in my cd and let me run a rhyme
And put your car on cruise and lay back cause this is Jalopnik summertime

Summer summer summer time...

Dr.Danger is in Denial

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @POLAR: Indeed, a Jalop-b-q should be in the works. then it should be covered extensively on the site.

Im in

danio3834

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @POLAR: So.. like woodstock, but cars? I'm down.

skaz

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @rlj676: But of those citizens that want the Big 3 to fail, all of them have some sort of agenda. Farago doesn't strike me as having an agenda.

skaz

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @skaz, Rust-MyEnemy & Al Navarro: I see a sunny day, an open field of Campers (that's Caravans Rusty) and Tents, BBQs blazin', engines revin', cold brews flowin', and hundreds of guys and gals staring back and forth wondering just who in the hell is who!

POLAЯBEEЯ

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @skaz:

I definitely see it from a different position, as when people there hope for the demise of the Big 3 it's my job they hope I lose essentially. He doesn't come out and say he hopes they fail, but it is a definite undertone to much he writes.

I probably lump him in though with commenters there that say more absurd things than he would. They are not banned though for stuff that will get you tossed if you disagree with him.

Oh, and there are definitely US "citizens" who hope for the fall of the big three.

rlj676

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @Al Navarro: I'd gladly help with a south/southwest arrangement, but unless people want to hang out in my cramped apartment we've gotta find some place. I only know of one decent car show in all of AZ, and it's in Yuma.

skaz

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @rlj676: I'm not going to say that I'm 100% for his policies, but I believe you're looking at him in a really strange light.

I highly doubt that any US citizens would wish for the demise of the big 3 unless they've got some other type of agenda to push. He runs a blog, if the Big 3 actually die he loses one of his main features.

And besides all that, they give glowing review to truly good American cars, and frequently bash Japanese and German autos as well. Their gripe with the American car industry is the industry, not the cars, not the people.

All things aside, I'm not sure that I like his commenting policies very much.

skaz

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @skaz:
I think I could help whip up a northeast jimmy jam. Oh, I'll be at Carlisle again this year..May 17, along with many of my Se7en brothers.

Al Navarro

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @skaz:

I'm pretty sure his "deathwatch" is not a sad series for him to do. Everything I read over there was so full of anti-big 3 bias it was sad.

Further, he runs the place like a fascist and bans for disagreeing with him under the guise that it was a "flame". That's what leads to (nearly) everyone on that site agreeing, coincidentally, with all of his articles, etc.

Like I said, there's very little "truth" to be had.

rlj676

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @Al Navarro: Probably. I wouldn't go to one if it wasn't in CA/AZ/NV, and I suppose I'm not the only one. So yeah, multiple doo-daddies.

skaz

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @Rust-MyEnemy: Yours' are all mad right?

See what I did there?

skaz

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @POLAR:
I'd be in...what about a car show? There'd have to be east, central, and west coast editions though, no?

Al Navarro

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @Rust-MyEnemy: Oh, thirded then, damnit

Rust-MyEnemy is stll out there!

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @POLAR: No. Seconded.

I'm willing to fly transatlantic for a decent steak...

Rust-MyEnemy is stll out there!

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @POLAR: Definitely not.

skaz

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Lets see, each of the automakers have unveiled an SUV Sedan/Coupe like concept (BMW, Toyota, Chrysler, Lincoln, Ford, to name a few) and precious little else. This seems to be a waste of a major international show.... Oh yea, and 2 new full size pickup trucks. Isn't there anything original being presented here?

UDMan

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Let's just say that if this post's title had begun with "Detroit Auto Show," I wouldn't have read it and wouldn't be commenting.

mobilene

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @POLAR: Am I the only wierdo who wants a Jalop-B-Q?

POLAЯBEEЯ

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Well, If Detroit press days are like the L.A. show press days, there is plenty of free booze and food floating around. Tell them to quit whining or next year they will have to cover it while the public is there!

Indiana Bento and the lost Temple of Citroens

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> i feel like i have seen the official reveal for the same car over and over. b-land.

harumph

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @Dr.Danger: YEAH! I like the brown ones...

[en.wikipedia.org]

POLAЯBEEЯ

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> You should do in Behind the Music style exposé of Robosaurus

Braff S. Preston, Esq.

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @Dr.Danger: what the hell?
I ment Boobies

Dr.Danger is in Denial

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> You should cover more Rallye Racing!!! And entries about car-nuts/ gearheads/ weirdos-like-us, are also great.

franzouse

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @POLAR: Naah. I prefer the Booby

Dr.Danger is in Denial

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @Spence: Yeah, they're great!!

[en.wikipedia.org]

POLAЯBEEЯ

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> The Goodwood Revival. It's the greatest automotive event in the world today and largely ignored by the US press.

Mr4speed

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @rlj676: That's a bit harsh. I really don't think Farago hopes for more issues, he's just pointing at the inevitable fall.

skaz

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @bzr: Amen, robble robble.

How about just re-tagging all "Auto Show" posts as "Auto Design Deathwatch."

Do a Design School Confidential. Send Leiberman or Johnson to ArtCenter on a Jalopreader funded scholarship. See if they can find out why car designers are trained to draw everything exactly the same way. Wind-tunnel glass turds with 24" wheels are cool once. Once.

Greg A.

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> How about covering some of the better hot rod shows out there?

gcmustanglx

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @PeteJayhawk:

I don't think anyone on the Jalop staff is a big enough dousche to relish/hope for increased struggles for so many people. Farago on the other hand, is plenty big enough dousche to do just that.

There's very little "truth" to be found at that place.

@Spence:
I second this. "Everyone" loves some T&A.


rlj676

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @PeteJayhawk: A report from an annual shareholders' meeting or two would be nice :)

Covering various types of auto events would be great as well (Pebble Beach, Corvettes at Carlisle, etc.).

FLB

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Summer Glau.

Al Navarro

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> More tits!

Spence

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> "...all the Detroit Auto Show coverage you can stand!"

I think you guys already summed it up. Things got incredibly boring after the ZR1 reveal.

I second the racing suggestion above. Maybe pick a couple of the best races of the season, i.e. Rolex 24 of Daytona, any ALMS, pack your bags, and go breathe some high octane exhaust.

Parramore64

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Maybe a running series on car companies' troubles...you could call it a Deathwatch or something. I wonder if anyone's done that.

PeteJayhawk

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @WesR: Great idea.

I also would like to see more road tests. More auto esoterica - old ads, weird -aminos and -cheros, DAFs, FAFs, ZAZ, ZIL, Trabant, et cetera. Bring on the weird.

PeteJayhawk

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Cover the increasing buying-up of roads built with taxpayer money by private corporations looking to take more of the taxpayers' money through exhorbitant tolls.

Sorry...been reading too much of Pat Bedard's column.

bmoredlj

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> You could cover a Jalopnik hosted Summer BBQ for the people of the Jalop-Nation!

...but no one would be reading it 'cause we'd all be there!

POLAЯBEEЯ

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> ..yeah. I'm a bit burned out, and a bit bummed. The only new reveal that we didn't already know about was the CTS, and GM was surprised that we didn't know.

Internet killed the auto show star.

skaz

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> I'm thinking you guys should cover some good road trips...like places to go mountain biking, camping, weirdest fishing town, unique car dealerships.

Let the creative juices flow...

WesR

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Detroit Auto Show Summary:

- Turd-shaped crossover
- Eco-friendly SUV
- CTS Coupe*
- Another turd-shaped crossover
- Van with hood scoop
- Pointless luxury hybrid
- ZR-1 Vette*
- Turd-shaped Electric crossover
- A 4-door, 4-passenger coupe?
- Yet another turd-shaped crossover
- Mazda Furai*
- Cheap luxury car knockoff
- Mach 5 (wtf?)
- Truck with cattle
- R8 V12*
- Premium luxury turd-shaped crossover
- Horrible pickup crossover

* = Actually worth looking at

Honestly, is it that much worse than watching a bald Britney chase you with an umbrella?

danms6

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> World of wheels! Check out the A+ linup of celebs at the Norlens show.

"Mater" and Jason Earles from Hanna Montana? Count me in!

Dr.Danger is in Denial

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @rlj676: at least there are plenty cheaper ones around you!

camp6ell

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> No! Never! Keep the swollen crossovers, big heavy hybrids (to keep the idea of the 3-ton pickup an ethical one) and identikit concept cars coming.

Gives us all something to despair at.

[/cynicism]

Rust-MyEnemy is stll out there!

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> @combat chuck: yeah, i like the oddball stuff like that. murilee has touched on SF city tow auctions before - how about a full-on feature on that?
spending a day with any of the following for a fresh perspective:
UPS/FedEx delivery guy;
service tech at dealership;
salesman at new car dealership;
salesman at sleazy used car dealership;
taxi/limo/car service driver;
snow plow truck;
highway patrol;
etc.

camp6ell

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> RV shows. I'm semi-serious, I think it might be a cool, tangential subject for this crowd. Most people seem to enjoy road trips, traveling, and cutting-edge mobile environments, all of which are epitomized in the US by the RV business.

Ash78

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> I'm burnt out on Detroit.

Oh, you meant on autoshow coverage. I was referring more to just living here in general.

Note to self, home purchase is not always a good idea.

rlj676

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> FYI, this was the lineup at the Autosport show this past weekend. Would you rather have seen these guys or Dr.Z getting propositioned by Kim Cattrell?!

Saturday
David Coulthard (F1)
Jenson Button (F1)
Mark Webber (F1)
Allan McNish (LeMans/ALMS)
Andy Priaulx (WTCC)
Marcus Gronholm (WRC)

Sunday
Allan McNish (LeMans/ALMS)
Andy Priaulx (WTCC)
Mark Blundell (ex-F1 ITV)
Bruno Senna (GP2)
Jason Plato (BTCC)
Matt Neal (BTCC)

Do it!!!!

Xman

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> You guys missed out, you could have been covering the Adult Video Convention in Vegas I see your sister site all over it.

htrodblder

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Racing. Any sort of racing is better than looking at cars standing still, especially cars that will likely never be put into production. You should forgo all of the other auto shows and just go to the AutoSport International show in the UK next year. Now THAT would be interesting to get a sneak peek into the next generation of racing technology which would be four generations ahead of what is the "latest thing" at the regular auto shows. You missed it this past weekend because you were all in Detroit having all that "fun".

Xman

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> I think Detroit is definitely more burned out than I am.

Wait, that wasn't the question. How about covering police auctions? Seems like the opposite end of the spectrum.

combat chuck

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Will there a be a Jalopnik booth at the Chicago show? or will us chiagoians have to hunt you all down?

reefer

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Wow... you came off like Howard Dean there... You should have ended that with "RAAAAH!"

Braff S. Preston, Esq.

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> Seeing as apparently every car built after 1970 is ugly and badly proportioned, yes.

Ok, I'm not that cynical. But this year's concepts have all been lackluster, even the Fisker Karma and its baleen grille and the Cadillac CTS Coupe when viewed from behind.

4.9 Port Fuel Injection BZR

]]> <![CDATA[Are You As Burned Out on Detroit As We Are?]]> The Hanna Montana tour.

M. Night's The Halfshafting

]]>