Am I wrong in saying that four guys in red climbing/constructing around traffic signals during the day MIGHT be distracting for drivers? I mean, all it takes is a second of distraction to bump the guy in front of you.
What is the dead time on traffic lights between red and green? Should we extend it from 3 seconds to 20 seconds so that morons know that yellow has some meaning? Yellow does not mean accelerate, it mean brake. No I am not a troll, common sense prevails.
@uUtan: It's not about whether yellow lights "mean anything" and nobody here is arguing that people should be allowed to run red lights (at least I hope not). The point that there are several major flaws with these systems;
First, because there is no human involved in the "arrest" there is no consideration for circumstances. Unlike a speed gun or other tools of law enforcement, this is a fully-automated justice system. You could argue that the court system is there for just those sorts of disputes, but it puts an extremely high burden on the owner of the car to prove that there were circumstances that led to the ticket -- and the only evidence provided by the camera is the one shot that shows the car in the intersection. For most judges, this is a slam dunk and there is no arguing out of it, and no chance to show that the light or the camera may have been malfunctioning or make other arguments.
Second is that these automatic enforcement systems are fining people based on what the car is doing - it's a personal violation based on a vehicular action. So regardless of who is driving, the owner of the car gets fined. That seems absurd to me for moving violations, particularly since there can be consequences beyond just a fine, such as points or license revocation. When the person who owns the car is forced to go into court to defend himself, it's a serious problem in the justice system in my opinion.
Third, and this is the most important, these systems are being erected by contractors in a number of cities purely as a way to make money, not reduce accidents. And cities are specifically reducing yellow light times to make more money. Contractors and governments are colluding to pass laws, raise fines and erect automated enforcement systems just to get a bigger slice of the public's money in a way that they don't have to raise taxes. Now they just say "well if you don't want to pay the fine, don't run a red light or speed" but when the entire system is designed to catch more and more people and charge them more and more money, regardless of public safety, this starts to look a lot like an Orwellian plot.
Ocean's 11 these guys are not, but they get good marks for both style and execution. I'd love to see this replicated in every city across the USA between now and Dec. 25th, and thereafter every year until we get rid of those damn cameras.
Wow, you know I'm real stupid, but wouldn't it just be easier to STOP for the RED LIGHT. Let's just go for total chaos and tear them down. I want to have an accident.
The beef against redlight cameras is not about people wanting to run reds...it's about being ABLE to safely run yellows without the fear of getting a ticket. Situations dictate behaviors, but cameras only enforce absolutes. A common result is more rear-endings, as people stop going through yellows.
12/23/08
12/23/08
12/23/08
12/23/08
12/23/08
I think I see the problem with your argument right there.
12/24/08
First, because there is no human involved in the "arrest" there is no consideration for circumstances. Unlike a speed gun or other tools of law enforcement, this is a fully-automated justice system. You could argue that the court system is there for just those sorts of disputes, but it puts an extremely high burden on the owner of the car to prove that there were circumstances that led to the ticket -- and the only evidence provided by the camera is the one shot that shows the car in the intersection. For most judges, this is a slam dunk and there is no arguing out of it, and no chance to show that the light or the camera may have been malfunctioning or make other arguments.
Second is that these automatic enforcement systems are fining people based on what the car is doing - it's a personal violation based on a vehicular action. So regardless of who is driving, the owner of the car gets fined. That seems absurd to me for moving violations, particularly since there can be consequences beyond just a fine, such as points or license revocation. When the person who owns the car is forced to go into court to defend himself, it's a serious problem in the justice system in my opinion.
Third, and this is the most important, these systems are being erected by contractors in a number of cities purely as a way to make money, not reduce accidents. And cities are specifically reducing yellow light times to make more money. Contractors and governments are colluding to pass laws, raise fines and erect automated enforcement systems just to get a bigger slice of the public's money in a way that they don't have to raise taxes. Now they just say "well if you don't want to pay the fine, don't run a red light or speed" but when the entire system is designed to catch more and more people and charge them more and more money, regardless of public safety, this starts to look a lot like an Orwellian plot.
12/23/08
12/23/08
12/23/08
12/24/08
12/23/08
12/23/08
12/23/08
12/23/08
12/23/08
12/23/08
Never EVER stop.
If you do, the bunnies will eat you.
They aren't red lights.
It's a ruse to get you to pause.
AND THEN THEY HAVE YOU!!!
12/23/08
The beef against redlight cameras is not about people wanting to run reds...it's about being ABLE to safely run yellows without the fear of getting a ticket. Situations dictate behaviors, but cameras only enforce absolutes. A common result is more rear-endings, as people stop going through yellows.
12/23/08
12/23/08
12/23/08
12/23/08
And they must have come up with this idea one night drinking heavily in a bar.
12/23/08
The cameras in Phoenix are becoming overkill. People are fed up.
[www.newsweek.com]
12/23/08
That young man is a Shining example.
12/23/08
12/23/08
12/23/08
Isn't that the tagline for Fiber-Con?