Don't forget the GT3 RS only comes with a six-speed manual (as do the ZR-1 and Viper ACR). If Porsche were to equip a GT3 RS with their new PDK system, it would probably be a lot closer to the GT-R's time, considering that it shaved 8 seconds off a 2009 Carrera S' Nordschleife time vs. a manually-equipped one.
@uncleben: Yes, you are not educated about the car and its capabilities. Like most people you know very little about the GT-R, but have a lot to say about it. Get educated before opening your mouth. #ringwars
@avanti5010: Slow down champ. Where is all this unwarranted hostilities coming from? I merely made a statement based on a observation and said that I do need to educate myself about this car. I never tired to put the car down, but merely stated that by looking at it I do not think it was so capable.
I just hoped that someone would take their time to help me understand why the car is as good as it is. Which "Power Tryp forever" has done and you have not.
I do have one request:
Don't cluster me with the Porsche fanboys out there. The ZR1 is still faster so I am happy and I don't want to get involved in the quarrel you Nissan fans have with Porsche fans. #ringwars
@uncleben: It's the classic tale of a car that is magnificent in design, yet poorly executed to save a buck. The GT-R design was a good one, but in order to cut costs and be cheaper than the rest, they appear to have used cheaper materials. This would refer not only to the grenaded transmission joke (cause nothing says a cheap car like buying a new $20k tranny), but to the general expense of maintenance (I'm looking at you $2000 tranny fluid every 18k miles). Then there are non-Jalop complaints like Evo's test where the demo car they had already had cracking brake disks.
This car has the same components you will find in a Porsche cup car (their actual race cars) sans the sequential six and full cage. So you can be assured it will run around the 'ring all day (as it does at the Nurburgring 24 and countless other endurance races), whereas the GTR race car is completely different from the street car (it doesn't even have the same kind of engine).
Then there is the whole issue of a lack of third party verification on the Nissan 'ring time. Porsche is famous for its production cars always achieving the claimed performance figures (in fact, they usually undershoot their claims). This has been verified on every last one of their cars, as they have been running the 'ring since before it was cool. This whole tiff started when Porsche walked into a random US Nissan dealership and bought a GT-R, then shipped it home to verify the time. The best they could manage was in the 7:50s. So far, no one has been able to replicate Nissan's time. Add to this that several magazines (I think Motor Trend was one) dynoed their demo car and found it had been tarted up a bit to wow the reviewers (which isn't all that uncommon). This all leads to the conclusion that the GT-R you buy will probably not be able to turn in a 'ring time of 7:26 or 7:29, but the average car owner (myself included) doesn't have the skill to max out the car anyways.
The final straw would be the warranty issue, where Nissan's clearly states that using your launch control will void the warranty as will dynoing it or taking it to a race track. Therefore, if you drive it in any way other than strictly to the letter of the law, the GT-R's data recorder will tell the Dealership next check-up, and ipso facto, warranty retracto. Contrast this to Porsche, which offers trackday and driver's ed (the race track kind, not the passenger brake kind) courses from the dealership, and will warrant it absolutely so long as you don't try to upgrade parts (although who knows how long that will last once VW has had their way).
The end result is a Porsche may be expensive, but it's not just a mark-up. You get what you pay for, and GT-R owners paid for a house on sand.
Oh, and do group me in with the Porsche fanboys: there is no substitute.#ringwars
That wreck of Kubica’s is still one of the worst incidents I've seen and is made even more impressive by the fact that his injuries were so minor.
I find it interesting that there are no shots of Williams BMW up there. The team saw some pretty good results with wins from Montoya and Ralphy boy. Pity that relationship fizzled.
@f86sabre: Agreed. Montoya's pass on M.S. in Brazil in '01 (I think that was like his third or fourth GP) was simply astounding, mainly because someone actually had the cajones to divebomb and hipcheck Schumi.
This new commenter editing interface dumps images among other things!
Mario Theissen, receiving the FIA's Ned Flanders Grooming Award for Best Mustache by a Team BossSadder still is that we might be losing an iconic F1 icon for the corner workers from the F1 pitlane.
Peter Orosz, maybe instead of just BMW, you can make this a feature and talk about the history of some of the other ex-F1 sports teams. There are quite a few interesting ones out there, including Honda/Mugen, Lotus, Arrows, etc. that I would love to see.
BMW is just the latest to call it quits in the F1 circuit, but a gallery of some of the other teams would be cool too.
Proof that advertising works--to this day, as a result of these cars, I still have a very good opinion of Parmalat. Hell, I didn't even find out what Parmalat was until about 10 years ago, and I still thought that (whatever it was) it must be cool.
Edited by The Curse of Harold Ballard's Bunker at 07/30/09 12:48 PM
The Curse of Harold Ballard's Bunker was starred
The Curse of Harold Ballard's Bunker was unstarred
@Syrax: Other companies that I have a lingering good feeling about as a result of racing: Olivetti and Alitalia (I swear to you that the Lancia Stratos could make dog shit sexy). And Benetton. Why are these all Italian? I have no idea.
OTOH, years of smoking left me with a negative opinion of Marlboro that no amount of BMW M1s could ever dispel.
10/28/09
10/28/09
10/28/09
oh wait. #ringwars
10/28/09
10/28/09
10/28/09
10/28/09
@Steve_in_NC: Hey you guys, remember not to dragon the gtr in public.
10/28/09
But still that time does seem suspect.
Maybe I'm just not that educated about the car and its capabilities.
10/28/09
10/28/09
I just hoped that someone would take their time to help me understand why the car is as good as it is. Which "Power Tryp forever" has done and you have not.
I do have one request:
Don't cluster me with the Porsche fanboys out there. The ZR1 is still faster so I am happy and I don't want to get involved in the quarrel you Nissan fans have with Porsche fans. #ringwars
10/28/09
This car has the same components you will find in a Porsche cup car (their actual race cars) sans the sequential six and full cage. So you can be assured it will run around the 'ring all day (as it does at the Nurburgring 24 and countless other endurance races), whereas the GTR race car is completely different from the street car (it doesn't even have the same kind of engine).
Then there is the whole issue of a lack of third party verification on the Nissan 'ring time. Porsche is famous for its production cars always achieving the claimed performance figures (in fact, they usually undershoot their claims). This has been verified on every last one of their cars, as they have been running the 'ring since before it was cool. This whole tiff started when Porsche walked into a random US Nissan dealership and bought a GT-R, then shipped it home to verify the time. The best they could manage was in the 7:50s. So far, no one has been able to replicate Nissan's time. Add to this that several magazines (I think Motor Trend was one) dynoed their demo car and found it had been tarted up a bit to wow the reviewers (which isn't all that uncommon). This all leads to the conclusion that the GT-R you buy will probably not be able to turn in a 'ring time of 7:26 or 7:29, but the average car owner (myself included) doesn't have the skill to max out the car anyways.
The final straw would be the warranty issue, where Nissan's clearly states that using your launch control will void the warranty as will dynoing it or taking it to a race track. Therefore, if you drive it in any way other than strictly to the letter of the law, the GT-R's data recorder will tell the Dealership next check-up, and ipso facto, warranty retracto. Contrast this to Porsche, which offers trackday and driver's ed (the race track kind, not the passenger brake kind) courses from the dealership, and will warrant it absolutely so long as you don't try to upgrade parts (although who knows how long that will last once VW has had their way).
The end result is a Porsche may be expensive, but it's not just a mark-up. You get what you pay for, and GT-R owners paid for a house on sand.
Oh, and do group me in with the Porsche fanboys: there is no substitute. #ringwars
10/28/09
07/30/09
07/30/09
Was Nelson Piquet's Brabham gorgeous or what?
07/30/09
That wreck of Kubica’s is still one of the worst incidents I've seen and is made even more impressive by the fact that his injuries were so minor.
I find it interesting that there are no shots of Williams BMW up there. The team saw some pretty good results with wins from Montoya and Ralphy boy. Pity that relationship fizzled.
07/30/09
07/30/09
Sadder still is that we might be losing an iconic F1 icon for those F1 folks pushing brooms.
07/31/09
@SeanKHotay: Hidely-ho, neighborino!
07/30/09
07/30/09
07/31/09
@NatefromOgden:This one is for sale, a steal at only 18000 Euro! Throw it in a tired E30 and go looking for bikes to race.
07/30/09
Mario Theissen, receiving the FIA's Ned Flanders Grooming Award for Best Mustache by a Team BossSadder still is that we might be losing an iconic F1 icon for the corner workers from the F1 pitlane.
07/30/09
BMW is just the latest to call it quits in the F1 circuit, but a gallery of some of the other teams would be cool too.
07/30/09
07/30/09
07/30/09
07/30/09
07/31/09
07/30/09
07/30/09
07/30/09
07/30/09
OTOH, years of smoking left me with a negative opinion of Marlboro that no amount of BMW M1s could ever dispel.
07/30/09
07/30/09