Detroit, 5:28 PM
Tue Dec 8
28 posts in the last 24 hours
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| posts about #newminicooperconvertible more → |
2009 New MINI Cooper Convertible Takes Top Off At Detroit Auto Show |
2009 MINI Cooper, Cooper S Convertible Officially Reveal Whopping Price Jump |
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Jalopnik 
01/11/09
01/11/09
Hey is anyone else having problems with the facebook connect?
01/12/09
01/11/09
AUGH! PUT IT BACK ON! GOOD LORD!
01/11/09
01/11/09
01/11/09
Suffice to say, I'm not excited at all about it.
11/29/08
11/29/08
..sie haben die Hoden...
11/28/08
That's actually a pretty good improvement. I rented one of these about a month ago and couldn't believe how bad the rear visibility was. With the top up, you've got the small rear window combined with the roll bars behind the rear seats blocking your view. With the top down, you've got the top that sticks up off of the rear trunk blocking your view. At least it sounds like they've fixed one of the two...
11/28/08
Actually, with decent side mirrors and a neck that works, you don't really need a ton of rear visibility.@DoctorNine, Experimental Vehicle Type II B:
Ya still dun't get it eh? Most people buy cars cause they're CUTE...
I know it's cute to pretend we're all pro race drivers and automotive engineers here, but in the real world, none of that matters when you're creeping along in 30 mph commuter traffic, which is where most cars spend their time, EVEN if you flog it a little on the weekends.
Note that none of you motorheads on here even begin to mention SAFETY in any of these cars, and my decades of experience in automotive sales and marketing have shown that you move sheet metal with LOOKS, MILEAGE, and SAFETY in that order. Performance comes much further down the food chain, because 99% of drivers can't evaluate or use performance features even if they imagine they can.
11/30/08
11/28/08
WTF? Is that something that appeals to the parade-and-pageantry demographic?
11/28/08
11/28/08
Oh, but how I'd love a Cinquecento, right? No one this side of the pond knows what the hell the original is, but they'd buy the hell out of it, that's for sure.
11/28/08
11/28/08
Mini S:
FWD, manual 6-speed/OD, 1.6L turbo, 172HP, 2668lbs, 26/34MPG, $22,600
SX4
AWD, manual 5-speed/OD, 2.0L NA, 143HP, 2855lbs, 22/30MPG, $17,389
If you don't need the convertible, the SX4 is $5000 less, and you can always put a turbo on that 2.0L, if you want more power later. I'd find it hard to buy the Mini at that price myself, even as much as I like them. I might do it if they put AWD on the table. Hmmmm...
11/28/08
What a deal? Not really.
11/28/08
11/28/08
11/28/08
Plus, if you're buying new and don't plan on keeping it too long, Suzuki resale value is absolute shit. Minis hold their value better than anything but probably the Prius. In the same vein, if you're buying used an SX4 should be a total steal. Although I'd probably look for an old Coop S with the supercharger first.
11/28/08
UNLESS THE MIGHTY JALOPNIK ROARS TO THE RESCUE...
(hope hope hope)
11/28/08
11/28/08
11/28/08
11/28/08
Again, there is NO comparison in the average Mini buyer's mind. A BMW engineered car based on a classic fun/racing machine from Britain, vs some generic far eastern crossover.
No.
Mini buyers on the whole, aren't performance geeks who are looking to dick around (add mods, etc.) with their vehicles after purchase.
You Japanese fan boys don't begin to understand why people buy Minis. Look up the consumer focus group info on Minis, and then give up on the futility of selling a SUZUKI no less, to Mini buyers.
11/28/08
....Umm... where to begin...
You sir, are under quite a misapprehension regarding preferences and automotive proclivities in my household. You should know that none of my automobiles is Japanese, although I do have a Tacoma pickup for hobbies, and just sold a Honda motorcycle. In fact, my taste in cars is catholic. Small c. Look it up. I tend to race VW and Audi products, but that has more to do with the fact that I have all the tools for those already than anything else. And I have been known to fabricate antique parts for old GM, AMC, or Morris vehicles from scratch when the mood strikes me. I am also a fan of WRC racing, which is why I made this comparison to begin with. Those enthusiasts who are willing to shell out the extra money for a 'Works' or 'John Cooper' Mini are indeed the kind of people who look at performance when buying a new toy. I am one of those kind of people, actually.
So please, spare me the marketing speak. If you are in any way connected to marketing or sales for GM, Cerberus, or Ford, I may be forgiven for doubting your ability to assess market accurately.
Comparison of performance and price is always a useful metric, for those who really like to drive. And BMW or Mini drivers actually tend to LIKE to drive. So the comparison is useful.
As to trying to 'sell' someone... that was the last thing on my mind with the discussion. I enjoy the considered (and quite educated, generally) opinions of those on this site. Just as one might at the pub. I always feel a bit curious about those who try to argue 'marque mystique' the way you are doing. I suppose there are people out there who don't look at actual data, but that sort of behavior has always mystified me. They get what they deserve.
The WRC SX4 is very entertaining. I think it could definitely sell in the US. And the same folks who buy Swifts, WRX's, et al, would buy them. My point was, essentially, that you can get better performer for a lower price than the updated Mini S. If Mini is positioning itself to do the same thing as BMW, and make 'marque mystique' the driving force of sales, I don't know how well it will succeed. It may. But Jag couldn't make that hump, and Mini may fail of the task as well. We will see.
11/29/08
(What would Alec Issigonis like?)
11/28/08
11/28/08
[jalopnik.com]
11/28/08
Also, High demand cars like the Mini often have dealer markup, kudos to the BMW group for trying to get their share of that pie.
Odd as it may seem, it may lead to more frugal shoppers buying Minis as well. Let me explain: As it is, if you don't pay over sticker on a Mini, you have gotten a "good deal". A higher MSRP should put the price up just enough to allow a buyer to get it at just under sticker price and walk away from the deal happy about getting such a great deal.
11/28/08
11/28/08
11/28/08
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11/28/08