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Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
The US Atlas Of Texting-While-Driving Laws

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twinturbo2
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
Dianne Fienstien is probably going to make this an issue when it expires. We need to stop her cold, and the rest of the Greenpeace alarmists before they destroy classic cars unchecked because they're old and don't run on unicorn farts and rainbows.
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Mad_Science
07/24/09

@twinturbo2: Those would be classic cars newer than 1984?
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twinturbo2
07/24/09

@Mad_Science: She'll probably want no restrictions on the model year of what can be traded in.
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MushyHeirloom
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
I still don't see why you can't trade in a beat-ass econobox on a new 30+ MPG compact/subcompact or hybrid. You can definitely find plenty of examples of this - a '96 Cavalier with the automatic can be rated as low as 29 highway, 19 city; it'll turn into a hideous eyesore if the middle-class female owner sells it on for several hundred bucks, but if she buys a new Mini, which puts out 6.3 tons of CO2 per year instead of 8.0 (assuming automatic to automatic) and gets an estimated 25 city, 34 highway, she's helping the environment and saving money on a new car she'll need soon.

(No man drives a '96 Cavalier by anything other than financial constraint.)

I use the Cavalier specifically because it's shit, and it's everywhere, and almost none of them get anywhere close to their EPA estimated mileage the way they're driven.
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MushyHeirloom
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
They're keeping the shells and destroying the engines.

Salvage-titled Tempos with modern powertrains for all!
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Van Sarockin, rogue trebuchet
07/24/09

@FP - missing Pete and the SHOwagon: There's a business here, slamming late model Japanese engines into older US based cars.

Japanese laws pretty much require trading in your car before it gets too old. They call it a safety measure, but it's really to help keep up demand for the manufacturers.
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Mad_Science
07/24/09

@FP - missing Pete and the SHOwagon: The VIN on the scrapped car gets blacklisted so you can't re-register it.
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Tiberiuswise is all ate up with sarcasm
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
I think it's interesting that this is coming out when most new car dealer inventories are down to a 60 to 45 day supply of inventory. Most manufacturers are therefore cutting back on rebates and dealers have reduced discounting for fear of running out of product.
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P161911 probably shoudn't have
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
This just MIGHT be profitable for me. I have a 88 F-150 that I've had for a couple of years, the truck is worth about $1500. The EPA combined rating is 15mpg under the new system. Go buy a Mini, Fit or some other car with nearly zero depreciation, turn around and sell the new car for maybe $2000 less than I paid, go find another old truck for $2000 and pocket the $500 or so left over after the tax, title, etc.

Something just doesn't seem right about junking a working vehicle though, especially a good one like a rust free F-150 with the I-6 and 5-speed. Sort of like having an old healthy dog put down to get a new puppy for free.
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GiovannaThemis
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
So you have to buy a brand new vehicle? You can't trade in your clunker for the 3,500 dollars and just buy a vehicle for 3,500 dollars?
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beercheck
07/24/09

@GiovannaThemis: Yep.
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Van Sarockin, rogue trebuchet
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
I guess she was right last year, when she told me that $100 Hummer would turn out to be a good deal.
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CaptMatt15 loves the Zoom-Zoom
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
I understand a lot of the hate for this whole thing, but my Girlfriend has the perfect situation.
Her old 95 Explorer gets 16 combined and has served her well through College. She now has a good paying job and is ready for a new car. She WANTS a small hatchback (Mini or similar) and there is no way the Exploder is worth $4500. She is the type of person this thing was written up for and she'll be trying her hardest to take advantage of it.

See, I'm sure she's not the only one with a situation like this... We all understand its not 100% practical, but it'll help some of the people out there.
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beercheck - Commentin' Dirty promoted this comment Edited by CaptMatt15 loves the Zoom-Zoom at 07/24/09 4:23 PM

beercheck
07/24/09

@CaptMatt15 is high on 9000 rpm: Exactly. But the rareness of her situation even goes so far as the fact that the $3000 of extra credit has been the dealbreaker that's kept her from making the trade already.
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CaptMatt15 loves the Zoom-Zoom
07/24/09

@beercheck - Commentin' Dirty: Actually the fact that she JUST started working and JUST now has income was the factor. She was going to buy a new car anyway.

I'm sorry I failed to mention she graduated last year.
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beercheck
07/25/09

@CaptMatt15 is high on 9000 rpm: So, she was going to buy a new car anyway. Great. Just great. I mean, good for her and her windfall, but her situation is, unfortunately, a perfect example of a negative side-effect of this program.

Unnecessary redistribution of wealth is awesome for the recipients.
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lilwillie
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
Whoever wrote this farce of a bill up must have been tapping out ashtrays from old clunkers and smoking what they found.
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CompWizrd
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
Can't I strip all the valuable parts off before i trade it in? I'm pretty sure I could take most of the car off and still have it moving under its own power. Might not want to trade it in if there's inclement weather though :)
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aSoundofSleep-less nights
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
This bill is an absolute farce. I work for a very large used car retailer therefore have done a lot of bookwork on this bill.
Doing the math, it's nearly impossible to ever qualify for it in the first place. To get the full $4500 you basically need to go from something under 18mpg to a Toyota Prius. The new car has to average over 22mpg and be a 10mpg gain over trade in. How many cars average under 18? In reality, not a whole lot.
For instance, let's say you drive an 88 Ford Ranger that averages 18. You want to get the full $4500 so you would need to find a car that averages 28mpg or more. There are only a handful of cars that actually average 28mpg. You're stuck buying something in the compact/hybrid range.
Not to mention that the dealer is supposed to foot the credit, and the government is going to reimburse them. The credit is also taken off the MSRP of the new vehicle, not a negotiated price. Dealers are just going to jack their prices up so that they don't have to lose any cash up front, because let's face it, dealers aren't exactly full of equity right now.
I'm also willing to bet that some of the more shady dealers out there aren't even going to follow the bill, still offer it off MSRP, keep the trade-in, and profit at a wholesale auction.
I could go on for hours how this is utter BS. I need a beer.
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G-Ram
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
So basically, to get the full $4500 for a new car... your current car has to get ≥12mpg?

Hardly anybody will qualify for that who is actually looking to take advantage of this deal. I figure pretty much any car that gets that kinda mileage is a performance car/street rod... people aren't going to trade those cars in.

In addition, I'd be willing to bet the government bases their choice around EPA numbers for when the car was new. So sure your beater might get 10mpg now, but "we're sorry, the EPA rating from 1988 was 18/24... here's $3500" seems like the bs you're gonna get when you apply for the stimulus.
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two wheels are enough
07/24/09

@G-Ram has a ★? No!: No, to get the full $4500 credit on a passenger car your trade-in car must get less than 18 combined city/highway MPGs AND the new car must get at least 10 combined city/highway MPGs MORE than your trade-in.

Case in point: I want to replace my Ford Ranger with a "passenger car". My truck is rated at 17MPG, so it qualifies as a trade-in vehicle. If I want to get the full $4500 credit, the new car I buy must be rated at at least 27MPG. If I'm happy with $3500, the new car I buy must be rated at at least 22MPG (the old 17MPG + 4MPG for the $3500 credit equals 21MPG, but only new cars rated at 22MPG or better are eligible for the credit).

And yes, the credit is based on the revised EPA rating for when the car was new. My '95 Ford Ranger barely qualifies with a combined rating of 17MPG.
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G-Ram
07/25/09

@two wheels are enough: Well thanks for clearing that up. I guess my thoughts are actually a worst case scenario. Say if you were looking at a new car that does get 22mpg and you wanted the full $4500 then your car would have to get 12 or less.
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Saboth
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
Just did this with Hyundai. Traded in my 93 F150 (prob worth 1k) and got 4,500 off an Elantra Touring. All told with cash back, CFC, and price wrangling, I went from 20k sticker price to 11,995.
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Braff
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
For all you Jeep Patriot fans (anyone?), now is the time...

Since Chrysler is MATCHING the C4C discount.
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spectra
07/24/09

In reply to Cash For Clunkers: The Official Rules
So, the '95 Wrangler, for which I got $400 when I traded it for a Prius last year, would now be worth $4,500?
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beercheck
07/24/09

@spectra: You're batting 1.000 in the getting taken department.
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drewdrawsLA
07/24/09

@beercheck - Commentin' Dirty: With the trade-in, or having to drive a Prius?
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Mad_Science
07/24/09

@spectra: You traded in a Wrangler for a Prius?

What the fnck it wrong with you?
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