Well, uh, half that would be a nice price for an oddity like this in good shape. But sixty-five hundred? Oh, hell no. Tall glass of Metamucil here. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
This engine alone did more to damage the reputation of diesels in the US than the rest of all combined together. In fact many times over. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
First time I heard of a diesel V8 made by GM was in a fake-wood-paneled Caprice wagon. Non-runner, and its in a personal junk yard full of goodies from Corvairs to AMC Eagles that will never see pavement again. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
Tony, I thought this came with a 4.5 liter gas engine. My bad.
This thing is so crack pipe, it resembles the aquaduct structure in Pompeii, after the earthquake in 62 AD. This won't even make it as a PCH entry, because even if you return it to 100% pristine, like new condition, it could self-destruct the next time you drove it, and even if it didn't, no one would notice it, except for the cloud of smoke.
Not only that, you almost don't dare to drive it, anyway, because the suspension is so awful that simply turning a corner can become a happening worthy of Bill & Ted's Excellent Adventure.
Worst of all, this car has no personality. You have to really look for the nameplate to know what it is. The Buick and Olds renditions of this car were enormously better, with tighter suspension and, as Tony noted, a decent gas engine which actually worked.
You can spend $6500.00 for this thing, but do it because you have fond memories of your grandfather buying one, just before they sent him off to the home, or because you collect Cadfillacs, and this is the only working diesel model you ever saw, or because you have a replacement gas engine, and a set of Riviera badges in the junk box. But for god sakes, don't actually buy it to drive. No one's that masochistic. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
@SmaartAasSaabr: According to the 1979 Cadillac brochure at The Old Car Manual Project website ([www.oldcarbrochures.com]), the Eldorado had two engine choices for 1979 - 350 cid gas or 350 cid diesel. The 368 came along for 1980 and became the unloved v8-6-4 for 1981.
Had this been equipped with the 5.7 gas engine, I might have considered this Nice Price for $5,000. Not with the diesel. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
I've seen pretty nice, nay _really_ nice cars of this vintage and powerplant go for $750 to $1500. So this is about 4 times crack value, at least. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
@mechimike: No kidding, my second job is at a used car lot. Last Thursday at auction I watched a SHARP '79 Eldorado (about 85K miles, I think, and looked dang near new) sell for about $2100. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
While I'm no tree hugger, the notion of converting this into the world's first "Biorritz" is oddly appealing. Can Vogues and smug coexist? #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
Believe it or not the Olds LF9 WAS NOT a bad engine. It was a potentially good engine that management and DFU's (dumb - users) made bad. To explain:
To be fair and to give credit to some of the criticism, the early "D" block ('78-'80 early m.y. '81) LF9's, while more powerful at 125 PS had some problems. The HOLES for the head bolts were not THD all the way to the bottom due to poor quality control on most engines (the block being thicker but using the petrol tooling, the last bit of the holes never got THD). 'No one thought of this' until late in the run and this was finally 'fixed for good' in "DX "block engines ('81+). Oil on "D" block engines needed to be changed RELIGIOUSLY every 3,000 miles using NOTHING BUT Rotella-T (I don't care what the manual says), or possibly Delvac. You can get away with the SAE-30 version south of the Mason-Dixon lines, but other than that, it's 15W-40. This is because of a propensity for soot build-up on the lifters and the poor quality diesel of the day.
The DX block was a much better engine with many of these problems solved, re-designed lifters to allow oil changes as late as 5,000 miles (STILL RELIGIOUSLY WITH ROTELLA-T). One of the biggest problems left was with the Stanadyne pump, being driven by a chain and getting out of sync because the chain would stretch (it needed to be a better alloy but was never done to give it commonality), but the chain would RARELY break with normal use. The fact that there was no water separator on either engine was the biggest problem. Water injection into a diesel can add additional pressure to combustion (some early jet planes had water injectors for extra thrust). This is bad in an engine that was designed to be just within pressure tolerances in order to get by. Failures ensued. Also headbolts were ONE USE ONLY and were commonly re-used after repair out of laziness or cheapness. Again repeat failure. Many mechanics of the day didn’t understand TTY headbolts, again, fail (not to mention, early TTY with flaky alloys were not that great to start with and needed periodic checking).
Most of the problem was with the bad diesel fuel of the day that had more water than oil in it (figuratively).
So this car belongs in a museum with a thorough explanation of how GM, its consumers, and the design all conspired to fail each other.
@DieselDutchman: Wow. Nice defense there buddy. 1 h-click for that.
But it's still is a crap engine. No I don't care if the ECU is wrong, or the tolerances are too tight, or the servicing needs to be perfect. It's still an engine isn't it? It's like saying the braking system is perfect except the actual calipers which apply the force. It's a system.
I don't blame the engine, I blame those dolts at GMPT (or rather their bosses) who got pressured into doing a rush job. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
Pieces of crap rarely age well. Unless you are a paleontologist this coprolite should remain hidden in the fossilized bone heap of all things GM late 70s and early 80s. It is crack I say. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
If I want an interior that looks like my grandmother's grandmother's parlour, I'll simply go to the thrift store and spend less than $100. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
Nice Price only because my father bought not 1 but 2 station wagons with that engine. Other than the occasional headbolt snap, and the need to put 1 gallon of kerosene in the tank before you fueled it up in those Maine winters it was a great engine. The 84 Oldsmobile Wagon he had got 32 mpg highway. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
@brandegee: Believe it or not in the Cole Land Transportation Museum in Bangor Maine they have a 1984 Oldsmobile 98 with the Diesel engine. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
@beercheck: Where else on the internet are you going to find the type of person who would go to a museum because he heard there was a really cool collection of antique snowplows. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
@My X-type is too a real Jaguar: I have been to this museum and have also seen that Olds 98. Decent work-a-day collection there, but Owl's Head has all the interesting stuff. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
@brandegee: Owls head is very cool as well, but the eccentric nature of the Cole museum makes it unique. Housing everything from the ultra rare BL2 Locomotive (one of only 59 ever built) to scooters, snowmobiles and the mentioned Olds 98. You just don't see that in museums founded by a group and not a person. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
If I'm buying an Eldorado with a ticking time bomb of an engine, I'm getting something from the past 15 years, for the 300hp. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
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This thing is so crack pipe, it resembles the aquaduct structure in Pompeii, after the earthquake in 62 AD. This won't even make it as a PCH entry, because even if you return it to 100% pristine, like new condition, it could self-destruct the next time you drove it, and even if it didn't, no one would notice it, except for the cloud of smoke.
Not only that, you almost don't dare to drive it, anyway, because the suspension is so awful that simply turning a corner can become a happening worthy of Bill & Ted's Excellent Adventure.
Worst of all, this car has no personality. You have to really look for the nameplate to know what it is. The Buick and Olds renditions of this car were enormously better, with tighter suspension and, as Tony noted, a decent gas engine which actually worked.
You can spend $6500.00 for this thing, but do it because you have fond memories of your grandfather buying one, just before they sent him off to the home, or because you collect Cadfillacs, and this is the only working diesel model you ever saw, or because you have a replacement gas engine, and a set of Riviera badges in the junk box. But for god sakes, don't actually buy it to drive. No one's that masochistic. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
11/09/09
Just that Olds 350 diesel could be had in every medium/large GM product... #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
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While I'm no tree hugger, the notion of converting this into the world's first "Biorritz" is oddly appealing. Can Vogues and smug coexist? #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
11/09/09
To be fair and to give credit to some of the criticism, the early "D" block ('78-'80 early m.y. '81) LF9's, while more powerful at 125 PS had some problems. The HOLES for the head bolts were not THD all the way to the bottom due to poor quality control on most engines (the block being thicker but using the petrol tooling, the last bit of the holes never got THD). 'No one thought of this' until late in the run and this was finally 'fixed for good' in "DX "block engines ('81+). Oil on "D" block engines needed to be changed RELIGIOUSLY every 3,000 miles using NOTHING BUT Rotella-T (I don't care what the manual says), or possibly Delvac. You can get away with the SAE-30 version south of the Mason-Dixon lines, but other than that, it's 15W-40. This is because of a propensity for soot build-up on the lifters and the poor quality diesel of the day.
The DX block was a much better engine with many of these problems solved, re-designed lifters to allow oil changes as late as 5,000 miles (STILL RELIGIOUSLY WITH ROTELLA-T). One of the biggest problems left was with the Stanadyne pump, being driven by a chain and getting out of sync because the chain would stretch (it needed to be a better alloy but was never done to give it commonality), but the chain would RARELY break with normal use. The fact that there was no water separator on either engine was the biggest problem. Water injection into a diesel can add additional pressure to combustion (some early jet planes had water injectors for extra thrust). This is bad in an engine that was designed to be just within pressure tolerances in order to get by. Failures ensued. Also headbolts were ONE USE ONLY and were commonly re-used after repair out of laziness or cheapness. Again repeat failure. Many mechanics of the day didn’t understand TTY headbolts, again, fail (not to mention, early TTY with flaky alloys were not that great to start with and needed periodic checking).
Most of the problem was with the bad diesel fuel of the day that had more water than oil in it (figuratively).
So this car belongs in a museum with a thorough explanation of how GM, its consumers, and the design all conspired to fail each other.
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But it's still is a crap engine. No I don't care if the ECU is wrong, or the tolerances are too tight, or the servicing needs to be perfect. It's still an engine isn't it? It's like saying the braking system is perfect except the actual calipers which apply the force. It's a system.
I don't blame the engine, I blame those dolts at GMPT (or rather their bosses) who got pressured into doing a rush job. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
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I blame Graverobber's style. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
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A heart-click for you. Well done. #1979cadillaceldoradobiarritzdi...
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