Tonyola makes an interesting point below about the decline of Chrysler quality. By 1953-54 Chrysler's market share was falling as Ford continued to pour huge resources into trying to catch up to GM, and GM responded by going "Hollywood."
Once the premium-priced Buick started challenging the low-priced Plymouth for third place in sales, Chrysler management blamed its conservative approach to design. So Chrysler went Hollywood too. The 1955-56s were the first step in that direction. Encouraged by increased sales, Chrysler then sped the introduction of Exner's low-slung tailfins of glory. If I recall correctly, the 1957s were originally intended for 1959.
Chrysler was merely playing follow-the-leader. In that era pretty much everyone was focusing on glitz at the expense of quality. The Edsel was the pinnacle of this attitude -- it was a "fancy" but utterly crappy car.
Chrysler clearly didn't learn from Packard's ill-fated 1955s. The formerly conservative automaker introduced interesting innovations such as an"electric" torsion-level suspension, but they were pushed to market too fast -- and were riddled with quality-control problems.
Ironically, Packard might have lasted longer if it had offered an old-fashioned but higher-quality alternative to the crap that the Big Three pumped out in the mid-to-late 50s.
@DrLemming: I take offense to your remark about Edsels, I happen to own four. The build quality is very...uneven, but the cars themselves feature a lot of interesting mechanical goodies. That is not in reference to the god-awful pushbutton auto transmission, which rarely survives in most cars.
Look forward to seeing the hopeless basketcase '58 Edsel Pacer team at a Lemons event in the future.
@Kirk Douglas: No offense intended. I've never driven an Edsel but recall reading a road test that pretty much panned the car, e.g., lots of body shake. Build quality is part of what I was talking about.
Too many automakers at that time thought people would overlook quality issues if the styling was snazzy and the technology fresh. The public thought differently. By 1959 they had gotten so fed up with Detroit's fare that imports -- and the dowdy Rambler -- were selling like crazy.
Hell, even my '67 A-108 passenger van weighed 3,900. Though that might have been with two 100 lb. bench seats in the rear, too. Glass ain't light, either.
@that ain't the way to have fun, son: Crazy stuff - it's got an additional foot-plus of wheelbase over my 240, yet it weighs barely more (and the 240 isn't that heavy by modern standards)... It's certainly more stylish, too.
It might be hard to believe after decades of K-cars, Sebrings, LeBarons, and other dross, but there was a time when Chryslers were the solidest, most indestructible machines on the road. Not exciting, not glamorous, but conservative, substantial, and upper class. Even Buicks of the era seemed Hollywood by comparison. It all ended with the beautifully-styled but horribly-built and rust-prone 1957 cars - since then, Chrysler made some great and exciting machines but they also had an endless (and ultimately unsuccessful) struggle in trying to rebuild a tarnished reputation for quality.
@CJinSD: The Valiants (and Darts) were durable products, but not necessarily quality. The drivetrains and suspensions were unbreakable. However, the bodies were prone to rust and the quality of assembly could be patchy - the interior of my '75 Duster was downright shoddy, and I've seen plenty of other Valiants and Darts from the early '60s on with slapdash fit and finish.
That car ought to be taken away from its owner for neglect and given to a foster family that will care for it.
If she were mine, oh and she will be mine some day, I'd paint her flat black all over but leave the stripe and Firebird emblem gloss. Put a 400 under the hood, some tint on the windows and buy her a nice new set of shoes, and she'd be perfect.
@weatherman: I wouldn't even paint it. Relish the beauty of patina, it gives the car character. Leave the trim rings off the factory steel rally wheels too!
Very nice, and a great writeup. But as for personal comfort, there were wing windows and personally adjustable footwell vents. Can't complain about the improvements to tires, though.
@Paul Y. can't get in the club; gotta parking lot pimp: I've almost sent a toolbox through the windshield from abrupt braking. Single master cylinder and four wheel drums, but newer than this pre-pentastar. But your brakes can never be too good, not grabby, just good.
@Muscles Marinara: I find the twin hood scoops on the Formula to be unattractive overkill. For me, I'd like the Trans Am hood and side vent on a car in a solid color (not orange!) without the spoilers.
any idea what's under the car cover in the driveway? (pic seven of the gallery, third pic in the article).. looks like a nice square four-door full sizer.. sixties? chrysler or ford maybe?
@günter macbeetle, codename: chrystlubitshi: i did not realize there was a time window on this long asked for edit function... i guess it could also be a GM product.. but i kinda crossed those out b/c of the squareness of that rear corner.. oh yeah.. and i neglected to add that i, too, think it could be a vehicle of the70's vintage
Edited by chrystlubitshi still güntered and dieseling at 12/05/09 11:22 AM
chrystlubitshi still güntered and dieseling was starred
chrystlubitshi still güntered and dieseling was unstarred
What you have there, Murilee, is the Firebird 400, based on the hood nostrils. You would have paid about a dollar a pound for the high ender.
Here were your options.
Cid HP Info
250 175 6 cyl
250 215 6 cyl
350 265 2 bbl
350 320 HO
400 330 4bbl
400 335 HO
400 345 Ram Air II
400 370 Ram Air IV
400 500 Ram Air V
@Novaload: This may well be a FrankenPontiac, stitched together from the corpses of 11 Firebirds and equipped with aftermarket Trans Am decals. You never know.
@Novaload: What specifically makes you think it's a 400. Even the wheels are correct Trans Am. Go here to see a bunch of TransAm pics. [www.highperformancepontiac.com]
Rust doesn't seem to have entirely overlooked this survivor. But a few more decals should fix that.
The T/A was never my fave, but I have always liked this body style, particularly for the Camaro. The front bumper is a high point of GM styling. Even the scoops, spoilers and flares are restrained and meaningful. Compared with cartoonish bloat and miniscule performance that was to come for the Fire Chicken, this is pure elegance.
@Van Sarockin, rogue trebuchet: That's just Northern California surface rust, from the rainy winters. Might be some rot under the rear window trim, but otherwise it should be just a little surface rust- no big deal.
@Murilee Martin: Compared to what the rest of the country has to go through, that's just pity-rust.
Still, somehow I can cope a little better when the car doesn't rust from the top down. Something about terminal cancer in your A-pillars, while the rest looks like it just rolled out of the factory...
The '70 Firebird and Camaro had the best looking schnoz of all the second-gen f-body iterations. Just look at that thing; looks like it could (and would) swallow small children whole.
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Once the premium-priced Buick started challenging the low-priced Plymouth for third place in sales, Chrysler management blamed its conservative approach to design. So Chrysler went Hollywood too. The 1955-56s were the first step in that direction. Encouraged by increased sales, Chrysler then sped the introduction of Exner's low-slung tailfins of glory. If I recall correctly, the 1957s were originally intended for 1959.
Chrysler was merely playing follow-the-leader. In that era pretty much everyone was focusing on glitz at the expense of quality. The Edsel was the pinnacle of this attitude -- it was a "fancy" but utterly crappy car.
Chrysler clearly didn't learn from Packard's ill-fated 1955s. The formerly conservative automaker introduced interesting innovations such as an"electric" torsion-level suspension, but they were pushed to market too fast -- and were riddled with quality-control problems.
Ironically, Packard might have lasted longer if it had offered an old-fashioned but higher-quality alternative to the crap that the Big Three pumped out in the mid-to-late 50s.
12/06/09
Look forward to seeing the hopeless basketcase '58 Edsel Pacer team at a Lemons event in the future.
12/07/09
Too many automakers at that time thought people would overlook quality issues if the styling was snazzy and the technology fresh. The public thought differently. By 1959 they had gotten so fed up with Detroit's fare that imports -- and the dowdy Rambler -- were selling like crazy.
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And those gauges could be framed and placed on a wall as a fine art work.
All the details, all the trim.
What a beauty!
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That is cool as hell.
I still can't wrap my head around a vehicle that large being only 3,200 lbs.
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Is it a Kei van?
Hell, even my '67 A-108 passenger van weighed 3,900. Though that might have been with two 100 lb. bench seats in the rear, too. Glass ain't light, either.
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If she were mine, oh and she will be mine some day, I'd paint her flat black all over but leave the stripe and Firebird emblem gloss. Put a 400 under the hood, some tint on the windows and buy her a nice new set of shoes, and she'd be perfect.
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I'll take some nice vent windows, though. I've always got the driver's window down a crack.
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You mean a crotch cooler.
12/05/09
"Mine. 1970 Pontiac Firebird, the car I've always wanted, and now I have it. I rule!"
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"I traded it".
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Dashboards are a real drag to replace, and keeping sun/heat off them is key to long(er) life.
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Here were your options.
Cid HP Info
250 175 6 cyl
250 215 6 cyl
350 265 2 bbl
350 320 HO
400 330 4bbl
400 335 HO
400 345 Ram Air II
400 370 Ram Air IV
400 500 Ram Air V
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Then again, I saw what most people saw of it, which was the rear, not the front!
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[www.highperformancepontiac.com]
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The T/A was never my fave, but I have always liked this body style, particularly for the Camaro. The front bumper is a high point of GM styling. Even the scoops, spoilers and flares are restrained and meaningful. Compared with cartoonish bloat and miniscule performance that was to come for the Fire Chicken, this is pure elegance.
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Still, somehow I can cope a little better when the car doesn't rust from the top down. Something about terminal cancer in your A-pillars, while the rest looks like it just rolled out of the factory...
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