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Detroit, 9:29 AM
Tue Nov 10
27 posts in the last 24 hours
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11/12/08
Not based on a car, van, or truck platform.
Taller than a Caprice wagon.
Shorter than a Caprice wagon.
At least 50% more cu ft than Caprice wagon.
Largely reconfigurable/removable seats inside.
Not RWD.
Engine and transmission do not intrude into the footwell.
Very car like driving dynamics.
Also Chrysler worked with Matra to design what the Espace was to become. It is as if Chrysler defined minivan twice at the same time.
11/12/08
11/12/08
My father was once a wagon owner, then, suddenly in the late 80s discovered minivans. Since then it he has had a succession of Chrysler minivans and loved them all despite my constant persuasion to purchase a more "capable" vehicle. I ended up buying one of those for our towing/race track use. His minivans always served as our crew vehicle.
While its not glamorous, I did much young driving and hooning in a minivan. They were great for teenage "camping" expeditions with friends etc. Much fun was had in the mommy-wagon.
Probably the most under-appreciated vehciels on the road.
If you're a used car buyer, they are a great value as nothing depriciates faster than a minivan.
11/12/08
I love you Jalopnik, but I will not take part in your minivan day.
11/12/08
After 30+ years of owning VW vans, my German immigrant grandfather discovered the Plymouth Voyager in 1992. He used it for hauling wood (among other things), as he was a carpenter. It was more than that, though. It was a sign that after 40 years of living as a foreigner in a foreign land, my grandfather finally considered himself an American.
And if you believe my grandfather was an idiot, then we're going to have a problem here.
11/12/08
I must say, though, that I think he should have sprung for the Chrysler Town & Country instead of the Voyager. Fake wood paneling on a carpenter's vehicle is just too good to pass up.
11/12/08
State-side anyway, there was nothing like it currently available in the 1980s. It was car-based, had 3 rows of seats, and was taller and more practical than a station wagon.
Conversely, the Vanagon was bigger, higher off the ground, and didn't exactly drive like a car the way Americans expected. Those little Japanese vans: they were seen more as utility vehicles.
I think what set the Caravan up as the ultimate family transportion solution came down to the finer details, too. It was styled inside and out as nicely as, or nicer than their k-car sedans. Not only was it smaller than other vans, it was JUST THE PERFECT SIZE for family needs.
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Not that the Blue Jays are any real competition, mind.
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11/12/08
If I was forced to buy a new minivan, I think the Mazda5 would be a good choice since I would want it to have some athletic ability, and the Mazda3 platform is a good place to start. The Mazda5 is just about the same size as the first Chrysler minivans!
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11/12/08
Not bad at all.
11/12/08
90-inch wheelbase,
168.4 inches in total length
65 inches in width
1983 Plymouth Voyager
SWB: 112-in wheelbase
SWB: 175.9 inches in total length
72.2 in in width
Other than having a FF layout...seems to me someone beat them to the punch.
Oh, but let's not beat up Mopar when she's down...
11/12/08
If I recall, however, it was just a little bigger than the Falcon van... but almost ten years earlier.
But you're right. Let's not beat up on Mopar when she's down.
*sneaky-kick-when-nobody's-looking...*
11/12/08
You mean this guy?
Or the SoCal skateboarder wannabee from the early '80s?
11/12/08
Minivan 2.0 (Mazda5) was pretty well-timed and POORLY executed, due in part to CAFE calling it a "car," while the Mazda CX-7 and 9 are "trucks". IIRC, the 5 is the #1 or #2 selling Mazda in Canada...but dead last in the US. I think they moved around 15,000 units here last year.
I say this only because I feel a Mazdaspeed5 (or even a diesel version) or a Ford S-Max would be the ideal car for about half the American population. People used to buy primarily on style, but there's a renewed consumer pragmatism in the current economic climate.
But then again, gas is as low as $1.50 in some parts of the country, so I guess it's back to SUVs again.
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Chevy's Astro was, and will remain in my eyes the purest form of a mini van. To borrow and bastardize a pitch line from Ertl, the Astro is just like the real thing, only smaller.
Kudos to Chrysler for making the "first" of what had already been around for decades and using it to define a market segment. Much as the Ford Explorer was the "first" SUV.
11/12/08
Van = Big Box on wheels to which "driving dynamics" do not apply. Thus, drive wheels are largely irrelevant.
11/12/08
The Aerostar's the closest thing to the Astro, of course.
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11/12/08
...kids these days... off my lawn...
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[en.wikipedia.org]
[en.wikipedia.org]
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11/12/08
Why in my day... uphill both ways... ant another thing... you kids... off my lawn... we liked it dagnabbit.
/Sorry, I seem to have had a little stroke there...
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