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Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
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allenparkpete
05/01/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
As an engineer who worked on the Grand Cherokee, Compass-Caliber, the still-born MK74 program and Mini-van programs I have to take exception to singling out the Grand Cherokee as a vehicle that caused Chrysler's demise. the Compass...yes. I used to have my fingers in my throat when I walked in the Studio. A lousy program directed by lousy leadership. And it was an Auburn Hills Jeep not a Plymouth Road Jeep. A big difference right there.

Chrysler's true demise started the day Maximum Bob was no longer President of Chrysler. Things would've been far different if that self-centered wop named Iacocca put his ego aside and gave Lutz control.
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Ben Wojdyla
05/01/09

@allenparkpete: Sorry Pete, I feel your pain, but the sales numbers don't lie. It might not have be the fault of engineering, or the bean-counters, but the precipitous drop in take-rate says it all.
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TechnoDestructo
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
These cars are mostly the symptom of Chrysler's death spiral, not the cause.

The Caravan/Voyager/Town & Country were the cause. They put more suicidal transmissions into more owners' hands than any car in history. Their reputation was irreparably tarnished by the vehicle that "saved" them in the 80s.
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If FromaBuick6 has to watch one more Chevy commercial, he's going to punch Howie Long in the face
05/01/09

@TechnoDestructo: There's some truth to that. But, really, Chrysler's quality was always lacking. Even back in the '50s, when the first Forward Look cars came out and were a big hit, once the quality gremlins showed up, sales dropped again. They were always good at coming up with stylish or innovative products that got people into the showrooms, but they were also good at selling lemons that kept a lot of people from ever coming back.

It used to be, if you bought a Mopar you had a 50/50 chance of getting an absolutely bulletproof car or the biggest piece of shit ever. Nowadays, it's a 100% chance of getting the ugliest, cheapest piece of shit ever.
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MushyHeirloom
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
The Dakota is ugly until you compare it to a Durango, Ram, Sebring...
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baldy_pm
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
What this article should have been is "The FIVE cars that didn't sink Chrysler"
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baldy_pm
04/30/09

@baldy_pm:

I actually don't think they have ever made 5 good cars.
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Armand
04/30/09

@baldy_pm: You're wrong!

1) Jeep Cherokee (grandfathered in from AMC): Capable off-road, livable on-road, arguably the first modern SUV.

2) '67-69 Dart: Legendarily tough engines, clean, pleasant styling, and simple, relatively reliable components. A favorite of old ladies in the late '60s and hipsters and hot-rodders today.

3) Hillman Hunter (grandfathered in from the Rootes Group-- a sentimental favorite for this Sunbeam owner): Chrysler's biggest international competition success was the Hunter's win in the '68 London-Sydney Marathon, where the little sedan proved tougher than the Lotus Cortinas and faster than the BMC Landcrabs. After this monumental achievement, Chrysler UK shut down its competitions department.

4) Dodge Viper: Bob Lutz's V10-powered toy brought performance and badass swagger back to Mopar after the depressing, if profitable, K-car era. Too bad it was too much of a niche product to make money for the company or share technology with other corporate platforms.

5) Number 5... hmm, number 5...

Fuck, you were right.
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Jesda
04/30/09

@Armand: The brakes from the Viper went into the Intrepid, and thats only one example.
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Mad_Science
04/30/09

@Jesda: How could we forget the Ram SRT-10?
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Armand
04/30/09

@Jesda, Mad_Science: Okay, fair enough. Let's make that "too much of a niche product to spread much of the platform's development costs over the corporate line through the sharing of parts, except for the V10 and brakes."

And in case you were wondering, yes, I am still pissed off that Chrysler shut down Chrysler UK/Rootes's competitions department.
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Six Flags Over Tomsk
05/01/09

@Mad_Science: Yes! Someday those things will be revered and appreciated for the beautifully demented machines they are.
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engineerd
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
You forgot:

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sean98125
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
I haven't seen a company that was so consistently bad at vehicle styling since AMC in the 1970s.
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Six Flags Over Tomsk
05/01/09

@sean98125: Oh really? Perhaps you have never gazed upon the wonder that is the Oleg Cassini Matador!

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Jo Schmo
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
I loved the first gen Durnago. It was a great family mover. Good power and handling. Nice interior and it looked good. I would own another one. My only complaint was gas mileage but that was not a big deal to me. The second gen Durnango/van thing was a huge FU to anyone looking to upgrade. I also loved the Dakota (previous gen) and I am toying with the idea of buying a gently used 4x4 quad cab. Again the next Dakota was a big FU to the fans. And it goes on and on. I swear this is who they hired to be chief of car design:

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Jo Schmo
04/30/09

@Jo Schmo: Durnago and Durnango? HA ha that right there is funny

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pauljones
04/30/09

@Jo Schmo: That is one sexy gold chain you've got there.
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Ben Wojdyla
04/30/09

@Jo Schmo:

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Armand
04/30/09

@Jo Schmo: Careful, he bites.
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Jo Schmo
04/30/09

@Ben Wojdyla: Ah nice, I'll have to save that one for my face-palm portfolio.
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Tier 5 royal, the Manic King
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
OH yeah, blame germans!

Even if they gave E-class parts for 300 which was relatively successful, SLK parts for Crossfire etc.

That's just stupid, if the Germans are baddest mofos ever how come they gave MB platform for newest Jeep?

What Daimler did wrong was that they didn't started by giving boot to American designers who produced those ugly designs which are listed in gallery above.
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Ben Wojdyla
04/30/09

@Manic King of Corinthia: You sir have no idea what you're talking about.
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Uncle Bo
04/30/09

@Manic King of Corinthia:

You're right. Because Daimler had no interest in buying a company that had $7 Billion in cash reserves, a fully funded pension plan, a perfect balance sheet, 15% domestic market share and lots of new, profitable product in showrooms and the pipeline.

Nope, the Germans were only interested in sharing their technology and engineering talent with a worthy partner, they being of such a giving persuasion.

And those American designers? The ones credited for creating the Viper, Prowler, Dodge Ram, LH sedans, Neon, Jeep Grand Cherokee, and others that led Chrysler to record profits and sales? They were led by Maximum Bob Lutz. I suppose the Germanic brillance of their unabashed geniousness would have given him the boot, too, seeing all the crap he was directly responsible for.

Did I say Chrysler had SEVEN BILLION AMERICAN DOLLARS IN CASH prior to Daimler's purchase? Sorry, wanted to be clear and all.
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sos10
05/01/09

@Uncle Bo: and still I'm pretty convinced that without MB things would have been the same, if not worse. The deal with Chrysler did cost MB a huge amount of money in the end... far more than those SEVEN BILLION AMERICAN DOLLARS IN CASH, actually MB was in the red for the first time (in their history or in a long time, cannot remember) after the first few years with Chrysler.
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Uncle Bo
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
The sad thing about the Commander is that underneath, it's quite a good car. Good rear suspension, excellent steering feel, very nice on the road. For an SUV, it's pretty surprising how well it drives and handles.

Of course its not helped by hideous styling, a cheezy plastic interior and lousy market timing. I'm a little saddened as it could have been much better.

And what has happened to the Grand Cherokee is a travesty.
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HDC
04/30/09

@Uncle Bo: Uh, the Commander was the Grand Cherokee underneath.
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Uncle Bo
04/30/09

@HDC:

Uh, yes I know. One was an establish, popular SUV that made Jeep massive profits until DCM bollocked it up royally and it lost its leadership market position. The other was not, but it was a good car in some ways.
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Franzouse
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
I don't get the quip about the entire MB lineup of cars. When DB decided to "merge" (or wtv they called it) with Chrysler, the pretext was to create a global player across all segments, which was indeed an epic fail.

But it seems to me that more parts and concepts went from Germany to Detroit than the other way, so how is MB responsible?

I'd rather blame the Executives who were willing to believe the merger could transform the Neon into a C-Class.
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Ben Wojdyla
04/30/09

@franzouse, weekend jalop...: The thing is, MB put tech and quality caps on a lot of Chrysler offerings, making it verboten for the US brand to even come close to competing with Mercedes.
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Franzouse
04/30/09

@Ben Wojdyla: Sank you vor zis explanashion.
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Armand
04/30/09

@Ben Wojdyla: I always thought they made the same mistakes BMW made with Rover; that is, they were so afraid of poaching sales from the parent company that they deliberately designed crappy cars for the subsidiary. Using the W210 E-class platform for the 300C was a home run, so why couldn't Daimler-Chrysler use a modified C-class platform as the basis for the Sebring? I don't think we'd all despise the Sebring so much if it had a capable, solid rear-drive platform-- I, for one, would be willing to overlook some cost-cutting measures in the interior if the basic car had some proper German engineering.
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Jesda
04/30/09

@Armand: Except the C-class itself is uncompetitive.
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Armand
04/30/09

@Jesda: True. But I think that its platform would still have been welcome in the Sebring's class even if it can't compete with the A4 or 3-series.
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Skunky
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
I also agree with the "entire Mercedes lineup," Ram Van > Sprinter. I love the utility of the Sprinter, but slushbox only with a V6, that earns a big ol' fat "meh."
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aSoundofSleep-less nights
04/30/09

@Skunky:

Sprinters are great, until you have to fix them. Expensive parts and labor is high, just like working on a Mercedes.
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Six Flags Over Tomsk
05/01/09

@aSoundofSleep Forager of Pistons: Funny thing, that...
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BlackMage is doing the Time Warp agaaaaaaain!!!
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
Can anyone name a current car the Chrysler produces that can actually be considered a viable competitor to ANYTHING offered at other companies, including GM?

It seems like even Chrysler's niche brands are woefully underdeveloped. Jeep hasn't had a true off-road offering in a decade. Mercedes is horribly behind the likes of Cadillac. (I consider those two more closely competitive than Audi, Volvo, Lexus, etc.) Dodge has some good offerings every once in a while, but they've consistently churned out nothing but slushboxy, fugly, plastic crap recently.

And now, because they failed so miserably, they're getting a golden parachute made from golden Andrew Jacksons, all 400,000,000 of them. I *almost* feel disgusted I voted for Obama, but then I think of what would have happened had McCain won, and I can't stop shuddering...
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GreenN_Gold
04/30/09

@BlackMage is doing the Time Warp agaaaaaaain!!!: RAM?
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engineerd
04/30/09

@GreenN_Gold: That's about it, and with Ford and Chevy getting much better fuel mileage, it's days are numbered.
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Mad_Science
04/30/09

@BlackMage is doing the Time Warp agaaaaaaain!!!: Dude, get your facts straight.

1) Mercedes is not part of Chrysler.

2) Starting with the Wrangler Rubicon in 2003, Jeep's making more capable offroaders than ever before. This is a fact.

Re: Competition.

The 4 door Wrangler kicks the sorry ass of the H3.

The Ram is the only full-size pickup on the market that I'd consider buying.
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dwegmull comments for the purpose of obscurity
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
Before commenting on the cars, I need rant a bit:

Welcome to Clickapaloosa! Seriously, why can't Gawker IT figure out a way for our editors to post 10 pictures with text in between them?

/Rant

Back on topic:

I'm not sure the crossfire really hurt Chrysler that much. For some strange reason I've always preferred it to the MB SLK, in the looks department. I've never driven either one, so I can't comment on that.

I have yet to see a Sebring that is owned by someone else than a rental agency (look for the bar code on the rear left window as a tale tale sign). Hopefully the it will disappear soon.

I like the first generation Liberty, especially the available diesel engine. It's a shame they never made it 50 states legal...

I don't find the new Dakota particularly ugly. I guess it suffers mostly from the fact that it went from being the only mid-size truck to having to compete against the Tacoma and Frontier. Being the only mid-size with V8 power is not exactly a compelling argument in the days of expensive gas either...
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SLRSpeedshop.. spewing crap here since 06,now wit deez Nutz!
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
Where's the Chrysler Pacifica? Terrible track record, poor sales. I disagree with Dakota's and Grand Cherokee, plus the Liberty making the top 10 list. They were all good in sales. Reliability? Not so much.
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weatherman
04/30/09

@SLRSpeedshop is not That Guy.: I would agree, but the figures that J-Nik uses on the Grand Cherokee are not good. I thought for sure they'd be higher. After the 2005 re-design I thought popularity had shot up, but maybe the SUV market just got much more competitive at that point and Jeep was just trying to keep up.

I'd buy a 2005 Cherokee. In fact, I still might.

As for the Pacifica, I never got inside one but I thought they looked alright from the outside. Certainly roomy looking, and a good alternative to a minivan. Not bad mileage for a car that size, either. Not for me, but I thought it was pretty successful.

I can't disagree that much with the top 10 list, though I do feel that with 4 out of 10 of them being Jeeps it's a little harsh. Jeep is still one of the most valuable brands that Chrysler has. Or maybe I'm just such a Jeep fan that I can't come to grips with reality.
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Ben Wojdyla
04/30/09

@weatherman: I firmly believe Jeep is an unkillable brand. You could rebadge a Tata Nano as a Jeep and it wouldn't kill the brand.

Any automaker worth their salt would kill to own the Jeep name brand and build high margin off-roaders.
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Mad_Science
04/30/09

@weatherman: As a Jeep owner and fan, the Liberty and Compass definitely belong.

The Commander isn't so bad, it's just they were priced like a premium product when they definitely weren't.

The tough part for the GC (and much of Jeep in general) is splitting the line between maintaining real Jeep offroad-ability and making an SUV that's competitive in today's SUV market (i.e. very sissi-fied and car-like).

The GC split the difference unsuccessfully: too unsophisticated to compete with an X5 or ML, too watered down to be taken seriously in the dirt.
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weatherman
05/01/09

@Mad_Science: I would agree about the Compass and would have included the Patriot on the list of offenses against the Jeep brand name. I guess I'm in the middle about the Liberty, which I think actually had potential and which, since it was redesigned, actually seems to be on the right track. The Commander is a bloated eyesore that might have been an easily corrected mistake at another time in the company's history, but instead ended up as the best example of their lack of forethought.

I am going to take issue with your take on the Grand Cherokee though. While it's no Wrangler, it is a highly capable 4x4. It's not a vehicle that you might go mudding in without doing some modding first, but for those who live in areas that require 4x4 capability, I think it's among the best options for 4-door vehicles. I'd take it over an X5 any day. Actually I'd take two, since that's the price difference.
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ptschett
04/30/09

In reply to Ten Cars That Crashed Chrysler Into Bankruptcy
I'd argue with most of these picks. The only ones I agree completely with are Sebring and the Merc's. I have an '05 Dakota and it performs well and looks good, the Dakota's problem IMO was that the competitors moved into its turf (thanks to the whole pickup market going super-sized) while Chrysler held steady.
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Mad_Science
04/30/09

@ptschett: The restyle from the 97-04 models to the fat-lip bumpered 05s was atrocious.

The slight refresh they got recently (smaller front bumper) helped a little.
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ptschett
04/30/09

@Mad_Science: Styling is subjective, I happen to like my '05 and can't be convinced that was the only reason it struggled (especially given the large strides in capability that the competitors made at the same time). I like the '08 a lot, but it's not enough better to justify trading in my pickup. (Then again I liked the '92-'96 better than the '97-'04 in the styling department.)
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theeastbaykid
04/30/09

@ptschett: It's subjective to the individual, but if you're a company trying to sell cars....
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