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Detroit, 7:48 AM
Mon Nov 16
16 posts in the last 24 hours

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    Dsmvwl  Admin  Promote to frontpage Approve user Ban user ×
    Image of wrx-tyrannosaurusWrx wrx-tyrannosaurusWrx
    01:02 AM

    In reply to GM To Begin Paying $6.7 Billion In Loans Ahead Of Schedule
    All the comments on this thread are poignant and well thought.

    I can add little to the conversation.

    But its a sunday night, and I've been drinking so, you know what? GM, you are officially on notice. Don't fuck this up. Pay when you profit, I don't want to have to bail your ass out again.

    Your brother Ford wouldn't do this to us.

    But I guess we dropped Chrysler on their head too many times. #newgm
     Reply
    wrx-tyrannosaurusWrx was starred wrx-tyrannosaurusWrx was unstarred
    Image of pauljones pauljones
    12:36 AM

    In reply to GM To Begin Paying $6.7 Billion In Loans Ahead Of Schedule
    I can understand physics. I can understand general calculus (Hey, not bad for a Psych major!). I even have some inkling of an understanding of particle physics and string theory.

    I cannot, however, wrap my mind around the concept of $50 billion dollars given to a single company.

    I love you, GM, despite the massive pains you went through the the past thirty years. You have matured from a spunky start up, to a wild child 'tweener. And you are at last just barely emerging from a state of chaotic metamorphosis into the beautiful butterfly you were always meant to be with excellent cars.

    But dammit, child, why the hell did that cost so god-damned much!?
     Reply
    Edited by pauljones at 11/16/09 12:37 AM pauljones was starred pauljones was unstarred
    Image of JCWhitless JCWhitless
    12:20 AM

    In reply to GM To Begin Paying $6.7 Billion In Loans Ahead Of Schedule

    I need to borrow $75 bucks to get my car out of the impound lot, so I'm going to really borrow $100 bucks from my brother and tell him I'll pay him back in a week.

    Then after I get my car, I wait a day and give him $25 and say that I won't be able to get the rest until two paychecks from now. #newgm
     Reply
    JCWhitless was starred JCWhitless was unstarred
    Image of Van Sarockin, rogue trebuchet Van Sarockin, rogue trebuchet
    12:08 AM

    In reply to GM To Begin Paying $6.7 Billion In Loans Ahead Of Schedule
    This makes holding on to Opel sound like a much harder task than previously posed by GM.

    Paying off the loans at an accelerated rate should boost investor confidence, and lower long term financing costs. But it also cuts into cash reserves and will affect any dividend payouts in the short term. #newgm
     Reply
    Van Sarockin, rogue trebuchet was starred Van Sarockin, rogue trebuchet was unstarred
    Image of that ain't the way to have fun, son that ain't the way to have fun, son
    11/12/09

    In reply to Daily Show: Cash For Clunkers Killing "$14 Billion" Demolition Derby Industry
    The 60's footage brings tears to my eyes.

    I spy a '58 Oldsmobile coupe.

    /curls up into a ball in the corner #cashforclunkers
     Reply
    that ain't the way to have fun, son was starred that ain't the way to have fun, son was unstarred
    Image of AmishJohn AmishJohn
    11/12/09

    In reply to Daily Show: Cash For Clunkers Killing "$14 Billion" Demolition Derby Industry
    I'm waiting for the commercial that riffs on the old littering commercials. A hillbilly wandering through a deserted demo arena... walking down the street as an endless parade of new cars, stickers still in the windows roll past... Then a hauler loaded with old cars goes past, he turns to the camera, we see a single tear roll down his face. Then he takes a big drink out of his mason jar of hooch, and we get the 1-800 number for the National Demolition Recovery & Support System, or some such. #cashforclunkers
     Reply
    AmishJohn was starred AmishJohn was unstarred
    Image of Amalgamated Stainless Headers, est.1978 Amalgamated Stainless Headers, est.1978
    11/12/09

    In reply to Daily Show: Cash For Clunkers Killing "$14 Billion" Demolition Derby Industry
    $2 billion in drop in clutches? Yeah, just wait until those DSG buyers start having problems. #cashforclunkers
     Reply
    Amalgamated Stainless Headers, est.1978 was starred Amalgamated Stainless Headers, est.1978 was unstarred
    Image of Ford Tempo Fanatic Ford Tempo Fanatic
    11/11/09

    In reply to GM Chairman Asks U.S. To Pay Auto Execs More Money
    For every Bob Lutz, there is an Ed Whitacre. Or two. #edwhitacre
     Reply
    Ford Tempo Fanatic was starred Ford Tempo Fanatic was unstarred
    Image of MechaMunch MechaMunch
    11/11/09

    In reply to GM Chairman Asks U.S. To Pay Auto Execs More Money
    It's really funny because when I try to negotiate for a salary around 50k, I get frowned on and told that I seem "A little too motivated by compensation."

    I'll take one for the team and settle for 500k any day. #edwhitacre
     Reply
    MechaMunch was starred MechaMunch was unstarred
    Image of snapoversteer 'bout to get told snapoversteer 'bout to get told
    11/11/09

    In reply to GM Chairman Asks U.S. To Pay Auto Execs More Money
    As a San Antonio kid and having litigated against SBC, let me tell you the only response you ever need for dealing with Ed Whitacre:

    SHUT UP, ED WHITACRE, YOU COCK! #edwhitacre
     Reply
    snapoversteer 'bout to get told was starred snapoversteer 'bout to get told was unstarred
    Image of Elhigh Elhigh
    11/11/09

    In reply to GM Chairman Asks U.S. To Pay Auto Execs More Money
    The backdrop's lettering is all out of order.

    It should read WTF?!

    You can find top-level people who will work for minimum wage. I've had lunch with homeless doctorate bearers who were literally working for food.

    So then, how much is Whitacre paid? It should be a matter of public record, considering how Uncle Sam is the majority shareholder, FIA and all that. And is he worth it? Could we get some kid fresh out of college with a BA in Business Management who could do, if nothing else, no worse than GM has managed to do over the past five years? If GM's executive offices closed for a year and the lines simply kept doing what they were doing, internal expenses would plummet, there wouldn't be anyone to bitch about pay caps (the UAW might, but that's another, different can), and I strongly suspect everything would get done with no problems.

    It's like a cockroach. Cut off the brain and the body keeps going. #edwhitacre
     Reply
    Elhigh was starred Elhigh was unstarred
    Image of Alfisted Alfisted
    11/11/09

    In reply to GM Chairman Asks U.S. To Pay Auto Execs More Money
    Hey, Ed... Remember back when we, the taxpayers, didn't own you? Back when you were free to pay execs whatever you felt necessary to get "the best" talent? How'd that work out for you? #edwhitacre
     Reply
    Alfisted was starred Alfisted was unstarred
    Image of Elhigh Elhigh
    11/11/09

    @Alfisted: That was much more eloquent, and to the point, than what I said. I should have read this first. #edwhitacre
     Reply
    Elhigh was starred Elhigh was unstarred
    Image of that ain't the way to have fun, son that ain't the way to have fun, son
    11/11/09

    In reply to GM Chairman Asks U.S. To Pay Auto Execs More Money
    The top-level people they've been employing SUCK, so paying more isn't going to change anything but cost more and attract more suck. #edwhitacre
     Reply
    that ain't the way to have fun, son was starred that ain't the way to have fun, son was unstarred
    Image of If FromaBuick6 has to watch one more Chevy commercial, he's going to punch Howie Long in the face If FromaBuick6 has to watch one more Chevy commercial, he's going to punch Howie Long in the face
    11/11/09

    In reply to GM Chairman Asks U.S. To Pay Auto Execs More Money
    He's right. Capping salaries is not a good way to attract and retain talent.

    However, the government, who votes on its own pay raises while being entirely devoid of talent, is probably not going to comprehend this. #edwhitacre
     Reply
    If FromaBuick6 has to watch one more Chevy commercial, he's going to punch Howie Long in the face was starred If FromaBuick6 has to watch one more Chevy commercial, he's going to punch Howie Long in the face was unstarred
    Image of DrLemming DrLemming
    11/11/09

    In reply to GM Chairman Asks U.S. To Pay Auto Execs More Money
    Executive salaries have risen far too high in the US. The last time I saw the figures, the American auto execs were making considerably more than their European and Asian counterparts. Surely no one can argue that this translated into a better-run Big Three.

    Executives should be paid at a level that accurately corresponds with their value to the corporation. In recent years that often hasn't been happening here in the US -- and not just with the auto industry. Somehow it is considered "normal" and "acceptable" that unbridled greed has trumped basic fairness and good business practices. No wonder our economy is in the tank. #edwhitacre
     Reply
    DrLemming was starred DrLemming was unstarred
    Image of Steve_in_NC Steve_in_NC
    11/11/09

    @DrLemming: If a company is run by the inept it should go out of business, not be propped up by my wages. If they choose to hire the likes of an idiot with a bad track record like bob nardelli and overpay him they should get what they deserve, not the food from my child's plate.

    It is these idiots being propped up by my wages that is the problem. #edwhitacre
     Reply
    Steve_in_NC was starred Steve_in_NC was unstarred
    Image of pmalik pmalik
    11/11/09

    @DrLemming: That might be the case, but unless you roll *all* American exec salaries back, the cap will only put GM out of business. So what if Japanese exec makes 19x average worker salary when I can find non-tarp position that will pay me the 300x.

    It's the flip side of the UAW/competitive wage argument : If other companies are willing to pay more than 500K for execs, GM is SOL.
     Reply
    DrLemming promoted this comment Edited by pmalik at 11/11/09 1:03 PM pmalik was starred pmalik was unstarred
    Image of DrLemming DrLemming
    11/11/09

    @pmalik: You aren't making an apples-to-apples comparison. Competitive wage arguments matter more at the line-worker level, where salaries can make a big difference in a family's economic solvency. Executive pay is so high that goes well beyond covering basic needs -- it's all about conspicuous consumption.

    At any rate, I don't buy the argument that money is always going to be the key motivator to attracting the talent that GM needs. Essentially they need another Lee Iaccocca. When he became head of Chrysler his salary demands were quite affordable.

    Think about it: Any exec with the talent to turn around GM will be more than amply compensated both in reputation and, down the road, financially. Given the stakes involved, inspired leadership will inevitably get on the cover of Time magazine and into the history books. That's career making. The money will surely follow. #edwhitacre
     Reply
    DrLemming was starred DrLemming was unstarred
    Image of pmalik pmalik
    11/12/09

    @DrLemming: This has nothing to do with basic human needs, it's a standard of living issue anyway. If I'm a top level exec making 10M a year, my lifestyle and expenses commensurate my previous income.

    GM is not looking for the next Jesus to try their luck on, they need seasoned professionals that know what they're doing. Those people know how much they're worth, so capping their salaries amounts to shooting yourself in a foot.

    All your arguments are applicable to non-Tarp companies also, which will pay their desired comp. If i turn around HP or eBay, I will get the same reputation and don't have to work for 1/10th of my market salary.
     Reply
    Edited by pmalik at 11/12/09 11:08 AM pmalik was starred pmalik was unstarred
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