Don't forget the GT3 RS only comes with a six-speed manual (as do the ZR-1 and Viper ACR). If Porsche were to equip a GT3 RS with their new PDK system, it would probably be a lot closer to the GT-R's time, considering that it shaved 8 seconds off a 2009 Carrera S' Nordschleife time vs. a manually-equipped one.
@uncleben: Yes, you are not educated about the car and its capabilities. Like most people you know very little about the GT-R, but have a lot to say about it. Get educated before opening your mouth. #ringwars
@avanti5010: Slow down champ. Where is all this unwarranted hostilities coming from? I merely made a statement based on a observation and said that I do need to educate myself about this car. I never tired to put the car down, but merely stated that by looking at it I do not think it was so capable.
I just hoped that someone would take their time to help me understand why the car is as good as it is. Which "Power Tryp forever" has done and you have not.
I do have one request:
Don't cluster me with the Porsche fanboys out there. The ZR1 is still faster so I am happy and I don't want to get involved in the quarrel you Nissan fans have with Porsche fans. #ringwars
@uncleben: It's the classic tale of a car that is magnificent in design, yet poorly executed to save a buck. The GT-R design was a good one, but in order to cut costs and be cheaper than the rest, they appear to have used cheaper materials. This would refer not only to the grenaded transmission joke (cause nothing says a cheap car like buying a new $20k tranny), but to the general expense of maintenance (I'm looking at you $2000 tranny fluid every 18k miles). Then there are non-Jalop complaints like Evo's test where the demo car they had already had cracking brake disks.
This car has the same components you will find in a Porsche cup car (their actual race cars) sans the sequential six and full cage. So you can be assured it will run around the 'ring all day (as it does at the Nurburgring 24 and countless other endurance races), whereas the GTR race car is completely different from the street car (it doesn't even have the same kind of engine).
Then there is the whole issue of a lack of third party verification on the Nissan 'ring time. Porsche is famous for its production cars always achieving the claimed performance figures (in fact, they usually undershoot their claims). This has been verified on every last one of their cars, as they have been running the 'ring since before it was cool. This whole tiff started when Porsche walked into a random US Nissan dealership and bought a GT-R, then shipped it home to verify the time. The best they could manage was in the 7:50s. So far, no one has been able to replicate Nissan's time. Add to this that several magazines (I think Motor Trend was one) dynoed their demo car and found it had been tarted up a bit to wow the reviewers (which isn't all that uncommon). This all leads to the conclusion that the GT-R you buy will probably not be able to turn in a 'ring time of 7:26 or 7:29, but the average car owner (myself included) doesn't have the skill to max out the car anyways.
The final straw would be the warranty issue, where Nissan's clearly states that using your launch control will void the warranty as will dynoing it or taking it to a race track. Therefore, if you drive it in any way other than strictly to the letter of the law, the GT-R's data recorder will tell the Dealership next check-up, and ipso facto, warranty retracto. Contrast this to Porsche, which offers trackday and driver's ed (the race track kind, not the passenger brake kind) courses from the dealership, and will warrant it absolutely so long as you don't try to upgrade parts (although who knows how long that will last once VW has had their way).
The end result is a Porsche may be expensive, but it's not just a mark-up. You get what you pay for, and GT-R owners paid for a house on sand.
Oh, and do group me in with the Porsche fanboys: there is no substitute.#ringwars
There was a commercial a few months back for Kraft ranch dressing. The ad consisted of a lady having people in a town called Hidden Valley taste the Kraft ranch dressing. At the end of the commercial, a consumer remembers "Hidden Valley" and "ranch dressing". It was probably the least effective ad campaign ever.
I'm not saying that the people in the market for an Audi R8 don't know the difference between it and a Ferrari, (though some seem to think that they can pass for a BMW [jalopnik.com] ). I just think that to non car people, this is an ad with a flashy red sports car, and at the end it said something about being a Ferrari.
He made a Facebook post? As an under-30 car guy, I now feel oddly compelled to go shopping for a $40,000 Golf, 'specially that one with the manual transmission for people who can't drive stick. If he bought me a Makers and Coke, he'd pretty much own my soul.
@CJinSD: Boy, someone really has it out for VW, don't ya?
From a quality-control standpoint, some VW models are lacking, but their engineering is generally excellent, and they offer some of the most Jalop new cars (affordable station wagon, clean diesel, manual transmissions).
10/28/09
10/28/09
10/28/09
oh wait. #ringwars
10/28/09
10/28/09
10/28/09
10/28/09
@Steve_in_NC: Hey you guys, remember not to dragon the gtr in public.
10/28/09
But still that time does seem suspect.
Maybe I'm just not that educated about the car and its capabilities.
10/28/09
10/28/09
I just hoped that someone would take their time to help me understand why the car is as good as it is. Which "Power Tryp forever" has done and you have not.
I do have one request:
Don't cluster me with the Porsche fanboys out there. The ZR1 is still faster so I am happy and I don't want to get involved in the quarrel you Nissan fans have with Porsche fans. #ringwars
10/28/09
This car has the same components you will find in a Porsche cup car (their actual race cars) sans the sequential six and full cage. So you can be assured it will run around the 'ring all day (as it does at the Nurburgring 24 and countless other endurance races), whereas the GTR race car is completely different from the street car (it doesn't even have the same kind of engine).
Then there is the whole issue of a lack of third party verification on the Nissan 'ring time. Porsche is famous for its production cars always achieving the claimed performance figures (in fact, they usually undershoot their claims). This has been verified on every last one of their cars, as they have been running the 'ring since before it was cool. This whole tiff started when Porsche walked into a random US Nissan dealership and bought a GT-R, then shipped it home to verify the time. The best they could manage was in the 7:50s. So far, no one has been able to replicate Nissan's time. Add to this that several magazines (I think Motor Trend was one) dynoed their demo car and found it had been tarted up a bit to wow the reviewers (which isn't all that uncommon). This all leads to the conclusion that the GT-R you buy will probably not be able to turn in a 'ring time of 7:26 or 7:29, but the average car owner (myself included) doesn't have the skill to max out the car anyways.
The final straw would be the warranty issue, where Nissan's clearly states that using your launch control will void the warranty as will dynoing it or taking it to a race track. Therefore, if you drive it in any way other than strictly to the letter of the law, the GT-R's data recorder will tell the Dealership next check-up, and ipso facto, warranty retracto. Contrast this to Porsche, which offers trackday and driver's ed (the race track kind, not the passenger brake kind) courses from the dealership, and will warrant it absolutely so long as you don't try to upgrade parts (although who knows how long that will last once VW has had their way).
The end result is a Porsche may be expensive, but it's not just a mark-up. You get what you pay for, and GT-R owners paid for a house on sand.
Oh, and do group me in with the Porsche fanboys: there is no substitute. #ringwars
10/28/09
10/02/09
10/02/09
10/02/09
I'm not saying that the people in the market for an Audi R8 don't know the difference between it and a Ferrari, (though some seem to think that they can pass for a BMW [jalopnik.com] ). I just think that to non car people, this is an ad with a flashy red sports car, and at the end it said something about being a Ferrari.
10/02/09
10/02/09
10/02/09
10/02/09
09/04/09
09/04/09
Your America webpage needs updating...it doesn't have your lame new logo yet.
09/04/09
09/04/09
From a quality-control standpoint, some VW models are lacking, but their engineering is generally excellent, and they offer some of the most Jalop new cars (affordable station wagon, clean diesel, manual transmissions).
09/04/09
09/04/09