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PCH, Italian Coupe For About A Grand Edition: Lancia Beta or Alfa Romeo GTV?
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scroggzilla raids again
11/16/09

In reply to PCH, Italian Coupe For About A Grand Edition: Lancia Beta or Alfa Romeo GTV?
The Alfa, once you've dropped $60-70k on it, could be worth up to $20 grand and will be the object of someone's desire. The Lancia, while not as bad as some would lead you to believe, will NEVER be worth $20k no matter how much you spend on it and no one but a hardcore Lancisti will want it. Therefore, Lancia. #beta
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bobdobbs
11/15/09

In reply to PCH, Italian Coupe For About A Grand Edition: Lancia Beta or Alfa Romeo GTV?
I've owned several examples of both these vehicles. The Beta is pure over-packed Italian front-wheel-drive engine bay hell. The GTV is a walk in the park, expecially after you convert to carbs. #beta
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Alfisted
11/15/09

In reply to PCH, Italian Coupe For About A Grand Edition: Lancia Beta or Alfa Romeo GTV?
I refuse to choose - both reside on my favorite ring of Hell. #beta
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Van Sarockin, rogue trebuchet
11/15/09

In reply to PCH, Italian Coupe For About A Grand Edition: Lancia Beta or Alfa Romeo GTV?
Both would be great projects. But the Lancia would be the harder project, and fewer people care about Lancias. The Lancia's body isn't near as sexy as the Alfa's, either. So it's an easy call.

But they are both big bumpered, emissions strangled Italian iron and aluminum, so everyone's a winner here. #beta
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Muscles Marinara
11/15/09

@Van Sarockin, rogue trebuchet: Actually, I don't really think the 2000 GTV was that emissions-strangled. For the 71 model year they actually increased the HP total up to 130, which is not bad considering the car still weighs about 300lbs less than a Honda Civic. And the Lancia's FWD. Ugh. #beta
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monsterajr
11/16/09

@Muscles Marinara: I agree. I'd argue that aside from the inclusion of the Spica FI vs. Dual Webers there is no emissions. The 75 or 76 on Spiders have power strangling emissions. and depending upon which alfisti you speak to, the stock Spica in top tune is a better driver than an equal Carb'd car. I loved my dual webers on my 72' but my 73' reliability and ease of starting sold me on the Spica. #beta
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SeanKHotay
11/15/09

In reply to PCH, Italian Coupe For About A Grand Edition: Lancia Beta or Alfa Romeo GTV?
If only the Lancia was a Scorpion, it might have a PCH chance in, uh, PCH against the oil-less, unknown titled, passenger windowless, 20-year-dusted, rusted-in-all-the-Alfa-places GTV.... #beta
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Novaload
11/15/09

In reply to PCH, Italian Coupe For About A Grand Edition: Lancia Beta or Alfa Romeo GTV?
I'm having trouble voting because I'm intrigued by the Cutlass with the potato for a gas cap.
Also, I know nothing about Italian cars, except that they are pretty and diabolically unreliable, and hence expensive. I'll go with the Alfa, though, because it looks more like its heritage and less, as with the Lancia, like an old Sentra or Stanza. Or Cressida. You know what I mean.

Because PCH is all about the suffering, and why suffer for what looks like an econobox?
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Edited by Novaload at 11/15/09 10:47 AM Novaload was starred Novaload was unstarred

Alfisted
11/15/09

@Novaload: Growing up in Seattle, before it was cool, we used to tell outsiders that the weather was awful, the economy poor, the area was the last bastion of west coast rednecks and the traffic terrible. All in the hope that nobody would come.

This is the same logic that drives those in the know to tell the world how bad these affordable Italians are - so that they will remain affordable. The truth is, they are remarkably easy to wrench on (by modern standards) and incredibly rewarding to drive. #beta
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Novaload
11/15/09

@Alfisted: Well, now you've ruined it, though, haven't you? #beta
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Armand
11/15/09

@Alfisted: Dude, don't tell them! I still haven't scraped together the money for a 1750 Berlina! #beta
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If FromaBuick6 has to watch one more Chevy commercial, he's going to punch Howie Long in the face
11/15/09

In reply to PCH, Italian Coupe For About A Grand Edition: Lancia Beta or Alfa Romeo GTV?
I'll go for the Lancia, because I'm absolutely shocked that any still exist. #beta
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Vintage Racer - with V-12 goodness
11/15/09

In reply to PCH, Italian Coupe For About A Grand Edition: Lancia Beta or Alfa Romeo GTV?

I know enough people to help me with the Alfa ... gotta go there... #beta
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Murilee Martin
11/15/09

In reply to PCH, Italian Coupe For About A Grand Edition: Lancia Beta or Alfa Romeo GTV?
Having ridden in Jay Lamm's GTV, I can say they're great cars... that is, after you write a 5-figure check to have Conrad Stevenson go through them. #beta
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tonyola
11/15/09

In reply to PCH, Italian Coupe For About A Grand Edition: Lancia Beta or Alfa Romeo GTV?
Forget the Lancia. It might be attractive but it's a malaise US special with a pathetic 82 horsepower out of the 1800 engine. Also, this car probably has the Soviet-sourced steel that Fiat received in payment for setting up the VAZ/Lada factory. It's a wonder that this car isn't a pile of reddish flakes. Maybe the paint is holding it together. Give it time.

The Alfa looks to be a private import. I don't think that Alfa was still selling the GTV in the US in 1974 (I couold be wrong, though). The front bumper looks like a Euro model. At any rate, it has the classic Giugiaro styling and these coupes have become genuinely collectible. Which makes it the bigger tease. You'll be forever chasing the ephemeral dream of creating a desirable driver that will be worth some coin. That makes it more hellish.

Glad to see PCH is back - I hope it becomes a regular feature again. #beta
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Armand
11/15/09

@tonyola: You've brought up something interesting-- I know that Alfa was still bringing GTVs stateside in '74, because a friend of mine bought one new, but I don't know how they escaped the big, fat impact bumpers that the DOT was mandating on other cars. #beta
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Armand
11/15/09

In reply to PCH, Italian Coupe For About A Grand Edition: Lancia Beta or Alfa Romeo GTV?
This was easy for me. You see, I've always loved Alfa GTVs. It's one of those "just right" cars that strikes a good balance in many ways: Small enough to be tossable, big enough to be comfortable; raw enough for track work, refined enough for long highway journeys; far more sophisticated than the average British sports car, yet still something a competent amateur mechanic can easily tackle. And they look fantastic.
I picked the Lancia. You know why? Because everyone else has a goddamn Alfa. Where I live, you can't shout "Spica injection is unreliable and produces less power than properly set-up Weber sidedrafts" without a crowd of Alfa fanatics coming out of the woodwork to explain how wonderful and easy-to-tune Spica systems are, and how it was only restrictive emissions requirements that made later Spica-equipped cars difficult to deal with. Likewise, you can't say the phrase "crappy high-carbon Soviet steel" without them explaining that Italian cars really don't rust that badly, as long as you don't get them wet.
I'm not a big fan of the Lancia. It's got a nice, snorty twin-cam motor, but you can get the same motor in a Fiat 124 Spider, and it will be placed in a better-looking body and driving the proper wheels. If you get the Alfa, you'll have the support of a group of friendly, knowledgeable, supportive Alfa enthusiasts, and when you're done with your project you'll get to drive around in an absolutely fantastic little car.

Where's the hell in that? #beta
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Six Flags Over Tomsk
11/15/09

@Armand: Couldn't have said it better. Getting the Alfa back on the road would be a cakewalk by comparison.
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Edited by Six Flags Over Tomsk at 11/15/09 1:47 AM

Alfisted
11/15/09

@Armand: Beautiful. Apparently you've spent some time on the Alfa BB. #beta
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Armand
11/15/09

@Alfisted: No, but yesterday I went on a road rally with this guy: [jalopnik.com]
and this guy: [jalopnik.com] #beta
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Maxichamp
11/12/09

In reply to New Book Chronicles Dreamy Alfa Romeo Montreal
Plus, the headlight mechanism is kewl. #bookreviews
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Maxichamp
11/11/09

In reply to New Book Chronicles Dreamy Alfa Romeo Montreal
All right, Montreal experts, is this Nice Price or Crack Pipe?
[karakullake.blogspot.com] #bookreviews
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Van Sarockin, rogue trebuchet
11/11/09

In reply to New Book Chronicles Dreamy Alfa Romeo Montreal
I don't generally say this, but something on the lens is obscuring my view of perfection. #bookreviews
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Maymar
11/11/09

In reply to New Book Chronicles Dreamy Alfa Romeo Montreal
I'm just glad I've never seen one on the road. Montreal drivers are notoriously, well, I don't want to say bad, but hard to deal with. #bookreviews
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