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Detroit, 2:49 PM
Fri Dec 11
28 posts in the last 24 hours

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    Dsmvwl  Admin  Promote to frontpage Approve user Ban user ×
    Image of gabeedwards01 gabeedwards01
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    Several points to make here.
    1. These cars shown above don't have bumpers. They have a section of the nose and tail which are safety zones for pedestrians. They're filled with nerf material and covered in flexy/brittle plastic so soccer moms can continue taking prozacs, ignoring their kids, and letting them run around in and out of the roadways like little crack-head godzillas.
    2. They could make solid steel/rubber bumpers that protruded through or sat flush with the match-painted flexy bodywork ... it would protect the expensive paint job and body, and headlights, but it would violate that whole "safe to hit pedestrians" thing - see point #1.
    3. Someone earlier mentioned that only trucks and SUVs have real bumpers. Wrong. Most of the new (since 2000) trucks have a "bumper" (in quotes) which actually consists of a double-layer of aluminum foil which is chromed and sold for well in excess of $600. The get dinged and dented and warped so easily that it really is meaningless to have them (one particularly good example is the 1999 onward Ford Super-duty hunk-o-foil). The newest trucks have chromed tinfoil... and most SUVs (since the word was invented by marketingtards in the early 90's) also don't have bumpers at all (see point #1).
    4. Older convertible sports cars (Porsches, Triumphs, MGs, Alfas, etc...) all had chromed steel or steel and rubber bumpers which the owners/customizers were quick to trim, shave, paint or frequently remove... the end result was that a bump would cause a ding or a scrape or a crunch and a large amount of bodywork, but that was the price to pay for a better looking car. A perfect example is the AC Ace versus the Shelby Cobra. One had bumperettes, one didn't.
     Reply
    FP - Funny how it seems quiet around here, eh? promoted this comment gabeedwards01 was starred gabeedwards01 was unstarred
    Image of MushyHeirloom MushyHeirloom
    08/06/09

    @Gabe Edwards: Four good points, combined with "little crack-head godzillas", earn you a hearty-click.
     Reply
    Edited by MushyHeirloom at 08/06/09 3:03 PM MushyHeirloom was starred MushyHeirloom was unstarred
    Image of philibuster philibuster
    08/06/09

    @Gabe Edwards: 5. Profit?
    And bravo.
     Reply
    philibuster was starred philibuster was unstarred
    Image of Bentoboxx, My Tank is full of it Bentoboxx, My Tank is full of it
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    I live in the city where most people have to street park on a daily basis. Almost everyone gets their bumpers chipped and scraped and it just makes the cars look sad.
     Reply
    Bentoboxx, My Tank is full of it was starred Bentoboxx, My Tank is full of it was unstarred
    Image of Electro Gyrocator Electro Gyrocator
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    Who is going to buy these cars and not have full coverage insurance on them? I think that's why people don't really care about this stuff. Nobody is going to go into a dealership and pay cash for ANY of these cars. The bank will require full coverage insurance. When it's paid off, it will get traded in.
     Reply
    Rockford_Brodie promoted this comment Electro Gyrocator was starred Electro Gyrocator was unstarred
    Image of 2trips 2trips
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    The IIHS fails to take into account that if my bumper is damaged, I will replace it with 2X4, re-bar and barbed wire. Maximum repair cost: $20
     Reply
    Al Navarro promoted this comment 2trips was starred 2trips was unstarred
    Image of MaWeiTao MaWeiTao
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    What I'm trying to figure out is how it is that the two domestic cars are so much more expensive to repair than the foreign ones.
    And the Maxima, which I'd say has the heaviest damage by far somehow manages to be so cheap? I find it hard to believe that the parts alone are going to be that cheap. Headlights alone run $600+ easily.
    But assuming these figures are legitimate either Americans are trying to make up for losses by charging more for parts or there's structural damage not visible in these photos.
     Reply
    Al Navarro promoted this comment MaWeiTao was starred MaWeiTao was unstarred
    Image of Al Navarro Al Navarro
    08/06/09

    @MaWeiTao:
    I got rear ended in my Audi TT a few years back. It appeared to be "but a scratch", but when they took the bumper cover off the underlying structure was also damaged.
    And sorry all you retro bumper people...the TT is one car that would look hideous with oldschool bumpers, IMHO.
     Reply
    Al Navarro was starred Al Navarro was unstarred
    Image of MushyHeirloom MushyHeirloom
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    This is all.
     Reply
    MushyHeirloom was starred MushyHeirloom was unstarred
    Image of Shadowguitar Shadowguitar
    08/06/09

    @FP - Funny how it seems quiet around here, eh?: Who says new cars are safer?
     Reply
    FP - Funny how it seems quiet around here, eh? promoted this comment Shadowguitar was starred Shadowguitar was unstarred
    Image of MushyHeirloom MushyHeirloom
    08/06/09

    @Shadowguitar: Well, they are - above about 15 mph. I'd still take my 20-year-old Volvo over almost anything not built in the past ten years, and many vehicles since.

    And I'd definitely prefer it in a sub-20-mph collision.
     Reply
    Edited by MushyHeirloom at 08/06/09 12:40 PM MushyHeirloom was starred MushyHeirloom was unstarred
    Image of If FromaBuick6 has to watch one more Chevy commercial, he's going to punch Howie Long in the face If FromaBuick6 has to watch one more Chevy commercial, he's going to punch Howie Long in the face
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    Maybe we don't need to go back to '70s-style 5-MPH bumpers, but I think it'd help if the "bumpers" were less integrated into the bodywork. The bumper should be separate from the grille and the rest of the front clip, so when it gets hit, the whole front end doesn't flex, crack and give way like this.
     Reply
    If FromaBuick6 has to watch one more Chevy commercial, he's going to punch Howie Long in the face was starred If FromaBuick6 has to watch one more Chevy commercial, he's going to punch Howie Long in the face was unstarred
    Image of sos10 sos10
    08/06/09

    @FromaBuick6 Misses the Banned: I hope we will have a come back of the non integrated bumpers; besides the practical sides, they also help make cars look less like blobs.
     Reply
    sos10 was starred sos10 was unstarred
    Image of narf narf
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    Beyond the lack of rebars and bumper shocks is also that corner lights are fully integrated into headlights nowadays. Instead of a $50 replacement, it's a $450 replacement.


    A while back, my dad got rear ended in his Volvo 940. Damage to the Civic that hit him included the bumper, grill, lights, fenders, and hood. Damage to the 940 ... replace the cover. $490, paid by the other guy, with just over half of that going to paint and labor.


    That said, it's all a matter of where it hit too. I was rear offset hit by an Accord a few years back in my 745, and that was over $2800 in damage (aluminum tailgate + rear quarter panel damage). I was OK with used parts, and the body shop worked with their insurance company, so the bill was just over $2300 instead. That said, I loved his excuse for hitting me. "I thought you were going to run the red light."
     Reply
    Al Navarro promoted this comment Edited by narf at 08/06/09 11:31 AM narf was starred narf was unstarred
    Image of Rockford Brodie and the Masters of the Hooniverse Rockford Brodie and the Masters of the Hooniverse
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions

    How is the Accord "marginal"? I had to induce a cornea-bursting squint for like 30 seconds, which is the longest amount of time I've ever looked at a new Accord on purpose, just to find the little discolored strip. I reckon that fix involves five bucks and a trip to Auto Zone for some Dupli-Color.
     Reply
    Rockford Brodie and the Masters of the Hooniverse was starred Rockford Brodie and the Masters of the Hooniverse was unstarred
    Image of Maymar Maymar
    08/06/09

    @Rockford_Brodie: Without reading the report, I'm assuming deformation of the foam within, compromising the effectiveness of the bumper (like how if you even drop a helmet, you should replace it).
     Reply
    Maymar was starred Maymar was unstarred
    Image of jp182 jp182
    08/06/09

    @Maymar - Save the CSRs!: But how much can that foam cost?? Removing Honda bumpers takes 10 minutes at the most.
     Reply
    Maymar - Save the CSRs! promoted this comment jp182 was starred jp182 was unstarred
    Image of CaptMatt15 loves the Zoom-Zoom CaptMatt15 loves the Zoom-Zoom
    08/06/09

    @Rockford_Brodie: Look at the hood gap (it seems a bit squished). That leads me to believe that whole corner of the fender area got pushed in.
     Reply
    Rockford_Brodie promoted this comment CaptMatt15 loves the Zoom-Zoom was starred CaptMatt15 loves the Zoom-Zoom was unstarred
    Image of Maymar Maymar
    08/06/09

    @jp182: Well, the matter there is how much a replacement bumper cover costs, and those are getting more expensive (from my minimal experience, it's difficult to have a front-end collision in a Chevy Equinox cost less than $10,000)
     Reply
    Maymar was starred Maymar was unstarred
    Image of Rockford Brodie and the Masters of the Hooniverse Rockford Brodie and the Masters of the Hooniverse
    08/06/09

    @CaptMatt15 is high on 9000 rpm: Coming from a world of malaise specials, I assumed that gap was normal. I also didn't know about the inner foam. Thanks (you too Maymar) for the pontification.
     Reply
    Edited by Rockford Brodie and the Masters of the Hooniverse at 08/06/09 11:56 AM Rockford Brodie and the Masters of the Hooniverse was starred Rockford Brodie and the Masters of the Hooniverse was unstarred
    Image of PowerTryp is holding a Fiesta party. PowerTryp is holding a Fiesta party.
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    Listen the reason it's costing an arm and a leg and your first born child isn't because the cars get more damaged than before, it's because the manufacturers charge the living hell out of you for the replacement parts
    I work in a parts dept and the price of bumper cover for a Crown Vic went from around $400 to about $800 in the past four years! A design that hasn't changed for the longest time gets doubled for no apparent reason. I could see it if they quit breaking and were made of some amazing material but they haven't changed it at all, I know, I've compared the old to the new.
    I understand that every one is out there to make money, but some of it is just stupid.
     Reply
    acarr260 promoted this comment PowerTryp is holding a Fiesta party. was starred PowerTryp is holding a Fiesta party. was unstarred
    Image of HurtsSoGood HurtsSoGood
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    Is it too much to expect that bumpers actually do their job, which is to protect the rest of the car from the kind of minor bumps that are kind of inevitable? If not, why bother putting them on cars at all?
    And whose brilliant idea was it to paint the damn things? Now you can't even breathe on them without scratching them. The old kind with chrome or rubber might have been uglier, but at least they worked.
     Reply
    HurtsSoGood was starred HurtsSoGood was unstarred
    Image of Tiberiuswise Tiberiuswise
    08/06/09

    @HurtsSoGood:
    You're right. They shouldn't even call them bumpers. They should just call them Crumple Zones and remove any pretense.
     Reply
    Al Navarro promoted this comment Tiberiuswise was starred Tiberiuswise was unstarred
    Image of roaduscarnivorous roaduscarnivorous
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    once again the gm product came in last. the damage on the fusion, 6, accord, and sonata really don't look that bad. i'd probably just leave it or look for a spare bumper from a junkyard a few years down the line
     Reply
    Al Navarro promoted this comment roaduscarnivorous was starred roaduscarnivorous was unstarred
    Image of P161911 probably shoudn't have P161911 probably shoudn't have
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    Bring back real BUMPERS!
    The battering rams of the 1960s, 70s, and early 80s might have been a little ugly, but they worked! Appliance cars such as these especially need real bumpers. The only cars that should be built without bumpers are sports cars. This was the case for the most part until the late 1980s. I actually liked the diving boards on my 1987 E30, great for driving in traffic.
     Reply
    P161911 probably shoudn't have was starred P161911 probably shoudn't have was unstarred
    Image of that ain't the way to have fun, son that ain't the way to have fun, son
    08/06/09

    @P161911 now with M POWER!: They weren't really monsters until the 70's/early 80's, and honestly, I kinda like 'em.

    With the metal bumper on the '85 RWD Fleetwood I used to drive, in a bona-fide tap, the idiot Oregonion stopped on a green light, making a right-hand turn, to let someone turning left from the opposite direction go first, I managed to do $600 in damage to her Civic's painted bumper.

    The dime-sized spot of paint left on mine came off with a fingernail.
     Reply
    Edited by that ain't the way to have fun, son at 08/06/09 11:06 AM that ain't the way to have fun, son was starred that ain't the way to have fun, son was unstarred
    Image of Prawo Jazdy and The Velocity Trumpets: I miss Deartháir II Prawo Jazdy and The Velocity Trumpets: I miss Deartháir II
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    I don't get it. I was backed into in a parking garage in Royal Oak. I was in a demo 2008 Chevy Malibu. The guy was drunk and backed up close to what the police believe to be 10mph, maybe a little faster and it cost.... wait for it... $471.36 to replace at a Chevy body shop. Not $3,400 Whats the deal?
     Reply
    Al Navarro promoted this comment Prawo Jazdy and The Velocity Trumpets: I miss Deartháir II was starred Prawo Jazdy and The Velocity Trumpets: I miss Deartháir II was unstarred
    Image of bmoreDLJ bmoreDLJ
    08/06/09

    In reply to IIHS: No Mid-Size Cars Score "Good" In Low-Speed Collisions
    It's doubtful you can have a front end that's easy to fix AND pretty. The big protruding rubber bumpers of yore got the job done, but I can't imagine them looking good on anything modern, unless of course it's a truck or SUV.

    Clearly front and rear designs - particularly those of high-volume mainstream sedans and wagons - are determined by occupant and pedestrian safety first, followed by the amount of money automakers need to throw at collision repair industry so they have a reliable stream of business. That latter bit keeps noses and butts nice and pretty...and ridiculously expensive to fix if busted up even at the lowest of speeds.

    The best advice I can give is drive defensively, brake early, and avoid close proximity with other vehicles whenever possible. Not easy in cities, but not impossible either.
     Reply
    HurtsSoGood promoted this comment Edited by Al Navarro at 08/06/09 6:17 PM bmoreDLJ was starred bmoreDLJ was unstarred
    Image of HurtsSoGood HurtsSoGood
    08/06/09

    @bmoreDLJ: I would settle for bumper covers that are less prone to scratching than the fragile things found on most cars nowadays. "Why bother" bumpers, I call 'em.
     Reply
    HurtsSoGood was starred HurtsSoGood was unstarred
    Image of snapoversteer 'bout to get told snapoversteer 'bout to get told
    08/06/09

    @bmoreDLJ: Break early? Sounds like my old M5. Broke early and often. The brakes were awesome, though.
     Reply
    Al Navarro promoted this comment snapoversteer 'bout to get told was starred snapoversteer 'bout to get told was unstarred
    Image of Al Navarro Al Navarro
    08/06/09

    @snapoversteer:
    [OMBUDSMAN'S NOTE: I fixed it for ya.]
     Reply
    Al Navarro was starred Al Navarro was unstarred
    Image of snapoversteer 'bout to get told snapoversteer 'bout to get told
    08/07/09

    @Al Navarro: You also suffer from compulsive editing disorder. Oh wait, I guess it's your job.
     Reply
    snapoversteer 'bout to get told was starred snapoversteer 'bout to get told was unstarred
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